Cayman Ride and Tires
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Thread: Cayman Ride and Tires

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    Cayman Ride and Tires

    This post is in the 987 forum (not tire) because I need sound experienced advice on my Cayman, ride, and tires. My Cayman is a 2007 model with standard suspension, on 2009 Boxster S II 18" wheels shod with 6 year old Michelin PS2s. On the roads I find myself on, the ride is the worst thing about the car. I have had stiff riding cars before, including an older M3, but the Cayman is just too much on my roads. Especially over sharp edged lips and potholes. I don't expect the tire to do anything over sharp drop offs on the freeway which all but launch me out of my seat. I need to find a tire with perhaps impossibly conflicting criteria. A softer ride AND crisp steering response. The Continental DWs supposedly give a good ride, but lack instantaneous steering response. Are the Michelin Pilot Super Sports my only real choice?

    Phil

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    Re: Cayman Ride and Tires

    I have had two sets of Conti DWs on an Audi TT and have a set of Super Sports on my Cayman S that replaced a set of PS2s.
    Best I can tell you is that the Super Sports are less harsh than the PS2s and the DWs are less harsh than the Super Sports. The DW is not a BAD tire as far as steering respnse goes and they are awesome in the wet and far better than either Michelin when it is cold. If correcting the stiff ride was my primary goal, I would go with the Continentals .

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    Re: Cayman Ride and Tires

    The Michelin A/S3 is a good alternative to the DWS. I had a set of these on my MK6 GTI with a full suspension setup and the ride was very tolerable. Those tires swallowed up imperfections in the road and still delivered above average performance, comparable to some summer tires. However if I was shopping for tires on my M3 or a Porsche, the PSS would be my only option, granted money wasn't an item.

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    Re: Cayman Ride and Tires

    Michelin Super Sports are miles ahead of PS2s in every category. I have them on my 08 CSS. I had Conti DWs on my 07 CS and they were a good tire too. I replaced PS2s on both and was glad to do so.

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    Re: Cayman Ride and Tires

    One note. It is easy to confuse the Continental DW and the Continental DWS. I would not put the DWS on a sports car. (at least I wouldn't leave them on for summer.) I have them on a Q7 and had them on an A6. Good tire but not a sports car tire. The DW is far better in wet and dry traction but does not last quite as long and is not recommended for snow use.
    they apparently TRIED to make it simple DW= Dry Wet, DWS = Dry Wet Snow. BUT when you say DWs (plural) THAT is confusing.

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    Re: Cayman Ride and Tires

    Back when I had the original PS2s on my 2008 with 19s, just before I went to the Super Sports, the tires were noisy, hard and slippery and just got really bad. I think it was around the 5 year age area and about 19,000 miles. I replaced all 4 with the Super Sports and it was like a different car. Very happy and already planning for the next replacement in a couple thousand miles. I'll do the Super Sports again, probably by fall.

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    Re: Cayman Ride and Tires

    I believe your harsh ride is the result of the age of the tires. The sidewalls lose their flexibility and it feels like the Flintstone's car. I had exactly the same problem when I got my Cayman: really old tires that had decent treadwear left, but were hard as rocks.

    Spring for some new tires and you'll feel a world of difference.

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    Re: Cayman Ride and Tires

    My experience with old tires is bad ride, too. New tires = new ride! I will give my Bridgestone RE-11icon's a plug here. Second set now with a very quiet ride throughout their life (about 18,000+ miles and a couple of aggressive track days). They have worn as evenly as I have had on any car showing the slightly greater wear inside the fronts due to camber. Pretty decent track day tire, too. I chose this tire after research showed, at the time, that Ferrari uses this tire at their driver experience due to wear ability and traction.
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    Re: Cayman Ride and Tires

    For FRESH tires, the PSS is much better than the PS2icon. For WORN tires. it's a night and day difference.

    I had PS2 tires on my 2006 CS with 19" rims... harsh, brittle ride, slippery and all-around felt like crap.

    Install some new PSS, and all is right. Still a "stiff" ride due to the suspension, but not a "harsh" ride.

    If you want ultimate comfort, the Conti might be the better choice, although the PSS will be worlds better than what you experience now.
    I like fast.
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    Re: Cayman Ride and Tires

    I hate to sound like a broken record in these threads, but if you're complaining that the suspension on your Porsche is too harsh, you bought the wrong car. These are high performance sports cars, not luxury barges. You can put on a soft sidewall tire like Sumitomo HTRZIII and maybe it'll feel a little better, but you'd probably be a lot happier with a mercedes or Jaguaricon or panamera instead. The reality is, your Cayman is a sports car and tweaked more for performance driving than most cars, but remains compromised by a horribly soft suspension too soft for actual sport applications, because customers buy them for the image then complain they're too harsh. It's why the 911 has become a watered-down gran touring car and is upsetting.

    Sorry you don't like your sports car has a stiff suspension. That's what you get when you buy a sports car.

    HTRZIII is a real suggestion, btw. Grip is as good as PS2icon in 3rd party testing but it has one of the softest sidewalls you can get in a max performance tire. It's also way cheaper than PSS or PS2. Soft sidewall tires like HRTZII, DW or PSS/PS2 are going to feel sloppy in transitions, though. If you want good steering response and performance, you need to step above max performance tires like PSS and PS2 and go with an ultra high performance tire with a stiffer sidewall like Dunlop ZII Star Spec. I run Star Specs and am super happy with them on my 2010 Boxster S. Hankook R-S3v2 might be a good compromise.
    Last edited by sjfehr; 02-17-2015 at 04:49 PM.

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    Re: Cayman Ride and Tires

    Six year old tires on a Cayman are beyond their useful life span. The discussion is kind of pointless until you realize that you have a car that is built to handle and the tires are a significant part of the equation. I guess a lesser performance tire will suit your needs, but you will definitely lose performance for the sake of comfort. Tire Rackicon has some great data. Good luck.

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    Re: Cayman Ride and Tires

    This will sound crazy, but I put Falkens on mine and absolutely love them. Six years is a really long time for tires, especially with these cars, you could probably feel the car run over a penny.

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    Re: Cayman Ride and Tires

    Quote Originally Posted by latechdawg6 View Post
    This will sound crazy, but I put Falkens on mine and absolutely love them. Six years is a really long time for tires, especially with these cars, you could probably feel the car run over a penny.
    Not crazy at all. The first track tires I ever bought back in 2006 were Falken Azenis 615s. They were not Rcomps but they were pretty darn good. I even ran them at Daytona at the first Audi Club event there.

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    Re: Cayman Ride and Tires

    Quote Originally Posted by sjfehr View Post
    I hate to sound like a broken record in these threads, but if you're complaining that the suspension on your Porsche is too harsh, you bought the wrong car. These are high performance sports cars, not luxury barges. You can put on a soft sidewall tire like Sumitomo HTRZIII and maybe it'll feel a little better, but you'd probably be a lot happier with a mercedes or Jaguaricon or panamera instead. The reality is, your Cayman is a sports car and tweaked more for performance driving than most cars, but remains compromised by a horribly soft suspension too soft for actual sport applications, because customers buy them for the image then complain they're too harsh. It's why the 911 has become a watered-down gran touring car and is upsetting.

    Sorry you don't like your sports car has a stiff suspension. That's what you get when you buy a sports car.

    HTRZIII is a real suggestion, btw. Grip is as good as PS2icon in 3rd party testing but it has one of the softest sidewalls you can get in a max performance tire. It's also way cheaper than PSS or PS2. Soft sidewall tires like HRTZII, DW or PSS/PS2 are going to feel sloppy in transitions, though. If you want good steering response and performance, you need to step above max performance tires like PSS and PS2 and go with an ultra high performance tire with a stiffer sidewall like Dunlop ZII Star Spec. I run Star Specs and am super happy with them on my 2010 Boxster S. Hankook R-S3v2 might be a good compromise.
    Thanks for your reply. With all due respect, I am fully aware the Porsche is a sports car, has a stiff suspension, etc. In my opinion, the Cayman's suspension is NOT too stiff or harsh from a general design point of view when used on most roads. It is just too much on MY roads, which are not YOUR roads. There are roads across the San Francisco bay which are perfect for the Cayman and the stock suspension tuning. But the roads I am on, are unfortunately, nowhere near that good.

    A different car that rides better is NOT what I want. I want this car to not beat me up. So, I am looking for a tire to give me as much relief as possible while not undoing the handling. It looks like the Michelin PSS may be best. It enjoys high marks everywhere on Tire Rack, including ride. They are expensive. My only other choice is to move or sell the car. I already don't drive it much because of the pounding. This is not the car's fault, it is the result of the Cayman on my roads.

    Interesting you mention the Sumitomo HTRZIII. Especially as a very soft sidewall tire sloppy in transitions. From a TireRack test, "...On the track, the Sumitomo HTR Z III showed poise and delivered responsive handling allowing it to produce the quickest lap time of the event...". This site, talks about the Sumitomo on a Porsche. I used the Sumitomos on my 1998 BMW E36 M3 sedan, right when they first came out. No reviews, but I took a chance. Disappointingly slippery feeling for the first 50 miles, but after that, I thought they were great. Maybe I am not that picky, and if I could get more feedback on the HTR Z IIIs on the Cayman, I will seriously consider them. Saving over $400 vs the Michelin PSS is appealing, especially since I need to sink in some $$$ for new tire pressure sensors.

    You mention HTR Z III and HTR Z II in the same paragraph. Maybe a typo but is well understood the old "II" is nowhere near the "III" in performance.

    I very well may purchased the wrong car for my roads. That really pains me. As a car enthusiast, having my car purchase decision affected by the condition of our roads is discouraging. I did test drive a new 2014 911 Carrera S with 20" wheels as well as a 2012 Carrera GTS. I then drove my Cayman immediately afterwards over the same route. No question, the Cayman rode noticeably worse. Really, quite different. I really wonder how much the old PS2s are affecting the ride. Will find out when they are replaced.

    Phil

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    Re: Cayman Ride and Tires

    Quote Originally Posted by PSM3 View Post
    This post is in the 987 forum (not tire) because I need sound experienced advice on my Cayman, ride, and tires. My Cayman is a 2007 model with standard suspension, on 2009 Boxster S II 18" wheels shod with 6 year old Michelin PS2s. On the roads I find myself on, the ride is the worst thing about the car. I have had stiff riding cars before, including an older M3, but the Cayman is just too much on my roads. Especially over sharp edged lips and potholes. I don't expect the tire to do anything over sharp drop offs on the freeway which all but launch me out of my seat. I need to find a tire with perhaps impossibly conflicting criteria. A softer ride AND crisp steering response. The Continental DWs supposedly give a good ride, but lack instantaneous steering response. Are the Michelin Pilot Super Sports my only real choice?

    Phil
    I've run Continental DWs for a year, it has great response and sticks great too. I bought them because the PS2icon's were like riding on rocks, its still a stiff car but tolerable. These tires just last forever and are a bargin.

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    Re: Cayman Ride and Tires

    You probably just need new tires. Slap on some PSS and you should be good to go.

    Also, it's actually worth having your mechanic to look at the dampers. Sometimes worn suspension dampers could also lead to uncomfortable rides.

    Good luck
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    Re: Cayman Ride and Tires

    Quote Originally Posted by PSM3 View Post
    You mention HTR Z III and HTR Z II in the same paragraph. Maybe a typo but is well understood the old "II" is nowhere near the "III" in performance.
    That was a typo, I meant HTR Z III.

    Generally speaking, anything with a soft sidewall is going to feel less precise in transitions than one with a stiffer sidewall.

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    Re: Cayman Ride and Tires

    There will be a world of different roads, back sensitivity and relative comfort which is not the same for all.
    I'm sure the OP just wants to be able to enjoy the car on more occasions and wouldn't mind a slight trade off hence the questions posed.

    PSM3, from what I've read on P9, there seems to be a few in the SF area that have similar complaints.
    Perhaps after you change tyres, you can also experiment with slight variations of tyre pressures also as they can affect the ride differently depending on your tyre choice.
    However you may also want to consider a drop to 17's if the comfort is really that bad in your area even on 18's (before buying new tyres!).

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    Re: Cayman Ride and Tires

    I put HRT Z III on my 05 Base Boxster after blowing out a Goodyear that the no longer made. I was not happy with them all. They felt very soft in the corners, and not confidence inspiring. I am about to replace my P Zeros on my 12 S and am thinking about going with the PSS. The P zero's do ride very nice though
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    Re: Cayman Ride and Tires

    Quote Originally Posted by PSM3 View Post
    Thanks for your reply. With all due respect, I am fully aware the Porsche is a sports car, has a stiff suspension, etc. In my opinion, the Cayman's suspension is NOT too stiff or harsh from a general design point of view when used on most roads. It is just too much on MY roads, which are not YOUR roads. There are roads across the San Francisco bay which are perfect for the Cayman and the stock suspension tuning. But the roads I am on, are unfortunately, nowhere near that good. . .

    Phil
    Yep, most of the roads around here suck - especially those roads that carrier heavy rush-hour traffic everyday. The Porsche is not fun to drive on those roads but once you get away from the city and away form heavily-used roads, the ride is much better. My PASM is almost always in the soft mode. I had the same issue when I had the Lexus IS F which was a bit harsher than the Cayman. I drove it to Colorado and once away from the Bay Area (and Denver area) the ride was fine for hours on end. I blame the roads.
    Terry in Sunnyvale



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