Page 1 of 2 12 LastLast
Results 1 to 20 of 23
  1. #1
    meisme33's Avatar
    meisme33 is offline Porsche Enthusiast
    Join Date
    Feb 2011
    Location
    Florida
    Posts
    201
    Downloads
    8
    Uploads
    0

    Track Prep for Sebring Feb 22-23 2014

    I went to Sebring last February and had an absolute blast, so I'm going to do it again. There is a thread somewhere on the forum of my pics and videos from the event. Technically, I'm still wait-listed for Saturday because I was late to register (reasons are many). Regardless, I'm getting my car ready to go and want to get some feedback on my setup this time.

    First the particulars: It's a 2008 CS with less than 40K, tiptronic, sport chrono, sport seats, and 18" wheels.

    Last outing I stayed stock and spent my money on the following: clear bra (full front, hood, headlights, mirrors, and half-fenders), a helmet, oil change, and new Motul 600 brake fluid. The car was great in do-nothing form save a few caveats. For my skill level, I didn't feel that lack of power was holding me back despite being way down on it compared to much of the field. Sure I got passed by better cars and better drivers, but more wasn't going to make ME better. Additionally the tiptronic transmission would short-shift 4th-5th putting me in what I considered to be less-than optimal point in the power-band. Other than trying to press the buttons myself, there isn't anything I can do about that. The stock Bridgestone 050A's weren't the stickiest and seemed like I could have taken corners faster with different rubber. I also think I bungled the tire pressures, but more on that later. Where I really felt short was in braking. I wanted to brake later and more aggressively, but I had to get on the brakes so soon and even the instructor commented on how I needed to either brake harder or sooner and was surprised that I couldn't make "harder" happen. My pads were running pretty low, but I wasn't entirely out of material.

    This outing, so far I have spent my money on the following: a GoPro for a second video angle, an external mic to try to avoid all that wind noise, oil change and brake fluid again, new stock brake pads all around, new Michelin Pilot Super Sport tires, and an alignment dialing in as much negative camber as they could with stock suspension. The result was approximately -1.0 in the front and -1.5 in the rear. I'll post the alignment specs a little later for commentary.

    I have some outstanding modifications at home that I haven't made yet that I could use some input on. First, I have a DREAM 1 in a box that's been sitting there for months. Is it easy to put on myself and I just need to go do it? Claims are +5 hp from reduced backpressure and a changed exhaust note. I know its a "can't hurt" option, but I'd appreciate any thoughts users of this mod have on its butt-dyno results and exhaust note impressions. Second is a Softronicicon tune. I made the purchase when the special was running months ago, but have been too lazy to plug my computer in to read the file, send it in, and get the tune back. Any added risks here when on the track? Do I just need to get off my lazy bum and do that too?

    I don't have oiling mods at all, but honestly there doesn't seem to be enough sustained high-speed insane turns to do the kind of catastrophic damage others have experienced. Additionally, as I said I have a tiptronic. I haven't heard of a single driver of a tip have an engine grenade on them, BUT please chime in if you know of this happening! It could be that over-revs are an impossibility on an auto making it less likely to damage. More likely I am really justifying my lack of action into a false sense of security.

    Finally, back to tire pressure. I ran cold temps of 33 front, 36 rear, getting into the mid 40s when hot. I am pretty sure that was all wrong, but I didn't see any strange tire wear as a result afterwards. I've tried searching for a definitive recommendation, and I'm sure they exist buried in some of the thread results, but I'd rather just ask again.

    Have I left anything out? Anything else I need? I'm not looking for big mods at this point as I'm already $3K in this time before event fees, gas, and a hotel. I considered Pagid Yellows to improve braking, but $600 feels like a big pill to swallow at this point. I am okay spending a used Kia on prep and the event itself, but not really much more.

    Thanks for all of your help! Let me know if I'll see you there!
    Last edited by meisme33; 01-31-2014 at 03:22 PM. Reason: Corrected brake pad pricing.


  2. #2
    amdeutsch's Avatar
    amdeutsch is offline PCA Member and DE Instructor
    2,000 post club
    Join Date
    Nov 2009
    Posts
    2,070
    Downloads
    14
    Uploads
    0
    My Classifieds

    Re: Track Prep for Sebring Feb 22-23 2014

    Quote Originally Posted by meisme33 View Post
    I considered Pagid Yellows to improve braking, but $900 feels like a big pill to swallow at this point.
    Not sure who you talked to on that kind of pricing.



    Call Clark @ ApexPerformance. He is a P-9 sponsor. I know for a fact that Pagid Yellows are cheaper than that. And while you are at it get some spare high temp brake fluid as well.

  3. #3
    meisme33's Avatar
    meisme33 is offline Porsche Enthusiast
    Join Date
    Feb 2011
    Location
    Florida
    Posts
    201
    Downloads
    8
    Uploads
    0

    Re: Track Prep for Sebring Feb 22-23 2014

    Quote Originally Posted by amdeutsch View Post
    Not sure who you talked to on that kind of pricing.
    Sorry, it should have read $600. I corrected the original post. I am open to spending it if its really going to transform my experience and made me safer, so let me know if you think that's the case. But then it may end up being more than that anyway as I have to pay to have them dropped in and then pay again to take them out when I get back. It'll save me some street-pad material to swap, but I'll cost me each time to do it.

  4. #4
    amdeutsch's Avatar
    amdeutsch is offline PCA Member and DE Instructor
    2,000 post club
    Join Date
    Nov 2009
    Posts
    2,070
    Downloads
    14
    Uploads
    0
    My Classifieds

    Re: Track Prep for Sebring Feb 22-23 2014

    Quote Originally Posted by meisme33 View Post
    Sorry, it should have read $600. I corrected the original post. I am open to spending it if its really going to transform my experience and made me safer, so let me know if you think that's the case. But then it may end up being more than that anyway as I have to pay to have them dropped in and then pay again to take them out when I get back. It'll save me some street-pad material to swap, but I'll cost me each time to do it.
    If you have to pay someone to change them then I would suggest you read the article by KS-CS and see how easy it is to do yourself.

    And brake pads don't make you safer. The nut behind the wheel is responsible for safety.

  5. #5
    meisme33's Avatar
    meisme33 is offline Porsche Enthusiast
    Join Date
    Feb 2011
    Location
    Florida
    Posts
    201
    Downloads
    8
    Uploads
    0

    Re: Track Prep for Sebring Feb 22-23 2014

    So cost/effort aside, would you say I should do the pads? Also, would you care to weigh in on the other points? Tire pressure? Tune?

  6. #6
    amdeutsch's Avatar
    amdeutsch is offline PCA Member and DE Instructor
    2,000 post club
    Join Date
    Nov 2009
    Posts
    2,070
    Downloads
    14
    Uploads
    0
    My Classifieds

    Re: Track Prep for Sebring Feb 22-23 2014

    Quote Originally Posted by meisme33 View Post
    So cost/effort aside, would you say I should do the pads? Also, would you care to weigh in on the other points? Tire pressure? Tune?
    Dedicated pads will last longer.
    Tire pressure is partially tire brand dependent and has been posted on here for your 987.1.
    Tune. I've seen Miata's beat GT3s because of driver skills and ability - very technical course without a lot of long straights. You already addressed this yourself.


    You need to learn your car, your capabilities and grow within instead of worrying about getting faster, having a faster car, etc. That will come in time. Trying to force it is incorrect. Listen to your instructors. Talk to people with the same car, how long did it take them, challenges, etc.

  7. #7
    DSC928's Avatar
    DSC928 is offline Porsche Enthusiast
    Join Date
    Sep 2009
    Location
    FL
    Posts
    162
    Downloads
    1
    Uploads
    0

    Re: Track Prep for Sebring Feb 22-23 2014

    I've run Sebring several times....fun track. Don't spend anymore money on the car until you get some more track time under your belt. Save your money for entry fees and expenses. Brake fluid is #1 thing and sounds like you got that. If you need brakes I would recommend calling Apex also, and the PFC 08 pads. Beyond that, get your tire pressures under control and the Cayman is plenty capable. I run 35-36 psi hot, all four tires. Check them after ever session and you will find your sweet spot, it's a little different for every driver/tire make/ track etc.... I usually start at 30 cold, work from there. The next mod I would recommend highly is a CG lock. It will keep your butt planted to the seat so you can use your arms and legs for operating the car, not trying to hold yourself in the seat.
    Russell Wittenberg
    2006 Cayman S
    1973 914 3.2

  8. #8
    charlie27's Avatar
    charlie27 is offline Porsche Chatter
    Join Date
    Nov 2013
    Location
    ca
    Posts
    31
    Downloads
    0
    Uploads
    0
    My Classifieds

    Re: Track Prep for Sebring Feb 22-23 2014

    regarding tire pressure - i would say anything over 40psi hot is too high.

    I would also look at the little triangles on the edge of the tire. If you are not hitting the tip of the triangle I would go lower. I would shoot for 34-36psi hot.

    i ran RE50A on my CS and not a fan.

  9. #9
    eric_l's Avatar
    eric_l is offline Porsche Prophet
    Join Date
    Aug 2007
    Location
    FL
    Posts
    97
    Images
    21
    Downloads
    23
    Uploads
    0

    Re: Track Prep for Sebring Feb 22-23 2014

    Sorry I won't be out there this Feb, my car is still recovering from a meet up with the tire wall in 3 in November.... (By the way I'm #830 in the instructors group in the Silver CaymanS)

    Some advice (take it or leave it)
    1) Tire pressure... Your _way_ too high if your getting to 40+. If memory serves on Michelin's I think you can use the pointer finger on the Michelin Man guy on the sides of the tires. The goal is to try to get just the very top of his finger worn to. More pressure will move the wear guide up, less pressure will move it down. But I have not run Michelin's for a number of years now. I would try shooting for something like 34-38 PSI all around just as you get to you pit. Ask your instructor to jump out and check the pressures, before reviewing your session.

    2) Brakes: Stick w/ the OEM's until the're gone. Not worth the money & hassle yet. After you get up to Blue then its time to think about 'em. I just switched over to PFC's after running Pagid Yellow, Yellow/Black, and all Blacks. I like the PFC better than the Yellows, and they don't wear down anything like the Blacks do.

    3) REMEMBER TO DRINK!!!! It might be cooler out, but Sebring will dehydrate you something fierce.

    4) Softronicicon tune: I have one, along w/ their Competition plenum. I would go for it, with an Automatic it can't hurt, and I found it helped smooth out my engine.

    5) I've not seen any body kill a Cayman at Sebring personally, but talk with Tom Heinz (black Cayman #57) about his experience at Daytona. (and ask for a ride along w/ him if you can, smooth and fast.)

    -Eric

  10. #10
    CaymanR99's Avatar
    CaymanR99 is offline Porsche Person
    Join Date
    May 2012
    Location
    Massachusetts
    Posts
    4
    Images
    1
    Downloads
    0
    Uploads
    0

    Re: Track Prep for Sebring Feb 22-23 2014

    I agree with everything eric_I said. You should get a fire extinguisher. Better to have it and not need it. After that you may want to consider shoes and gloves.

    Seems like you have everything else you need for now. You'll get the most from spending your money on more DE's (I.e. seat time).
    CaymanR99

  11. #11
    j patterson's Avatar
    j patterson is offline Porsche Activist
    Join Date
    Jul 2013
    Location
    Alabama
    Posts
    458
    Downloads
    1
    Uploads
    0

    Re: Track Prep for Sebring Feb 22-23 2014

    Very good advice above. Cold tire pressures do not matter. They are simply a starting point to get to the on track hot pressures. Measure them hot and bleed down till you are happy. Likely at about 35--38 psi depending on you and on the tires. Brake pads matter. As you advance you will need higher MOT (maximum operating temperature) I like a high friction coefficient pad. I have had Cobalt XR2s and Carbotech XP12s that I liked a lot. A cheaper pad that gets good reviews is the Stoptech 309. I have a set to try on the Cayman S. Bleed your brakes with good DOT 4 if it has been more than 6 months. DO IT. Good drivers can get around very quickly on street tires like Michelin Pilot Super Sports or Hankook RS3s. The R comps are like a drug. Don't try them unless you want to get hooked. (I'm in rehab :-) ) Get a CG lock as was already stated. I have Schroth 4 points in my Audi but in truth the CG lock was nearly as good and I plan to use them in the Cayman S. Finally, Get a good Halotron fire extinguisher. I had a fuel leak at VIR last year in the Audi and an instructor saved my car with one. I will never go to the track without one again. BE smooth :-)

  12. #12
    meisme33's Avatar
    meisme33 is offline Porsche Enthusiast
    Join Date
    Feb 2011
    Location
    Florida
    Posts
    201
    Downloads
    8
    Uploads
    0

    Re: Track Prep for Sebring Feb 22-23 2014

    All excellent advice. I think I'll go ahead and do the Softronicicon tune. I'll give the new brake pads another try before moving up to something more aggressive. I have a good tire gauge with a bleed off valve and everything, it was me who needed to be recalibrated. I have good shoes and a pair of gloves, though I didn't use them last time. Fire extinguisher is a good call... I hadn't really thought of that!

  13. #13
    Craig@Rennstore.com is offline Bronze Sponsor
    1,000 post club
    Join Date
    Jun 2007
    Location
    Kirkland, WA
    Posts
    1,964
    Downloads
    0
    Uploads
    0

    Re: Track Prep for Sebring Feb 22-23 2014

    Track pads and Motul fluid nearly a requirement for Sebring -the place is HELL ON BRAKES. Yellows up front and Blacks rear or Yellows/Yellows. Have them in stock!
    Craig
    425-765-1090, www.Rennstore.com --assistance & discussion for your pad selection welcomed

    PAGID brake pads - Daytona 24 hr winners in every podium position

    GiroDisc brake systems and pad spreaders NOW AVAILABLE - SPECIAL PRICING!



    E-mail for any questions: Rennstore@Comcast.net

  14. #14
    alasorte's Avatar
    alasorte is offline Porsche Chatter
    Join Date
    Aug 2012
    Location
    Florida
    Posts
    26
    Downloads
    4
    Uploads
    0

    Re: Track Prep for Sebring Feb 22-23 2014

    I 'd invest in a set of track pads. I just popped a new set of Pagid Yellows in this week. The last two sets lasted 12 to 14 hard track days each. Previously, I was lucky to get 3 or 4 track days on stock pads. Pagids cost twice what stock pads do, but you get 3 or 4 times the wear, so they're cheaper on the long run.. You will notice the difference in grip, and they won't fade late in the day like stock pads.

    Don't worry about the Dream I. You will never notice a difference from just 5 HP.

    Tire pressures do sound a bit high. High 30's is more common on the track. Low 40's is too much.

    And the fire extinguisher is a good idea.

    Any more money should be spent on track time. That is the best way to get faster, no doubt.

    I'll see you there. Silver Cayman S, number 293.
    2009 Cayman S, PDK, Sport Plus, GT3 master, Pagid Yellows, GiroDiscs

  15. #15
    Craig@Rennstore.com is offline Bronze Sponsor
    1,000 post club
    Join Date
    Jun 2007
    Location
    Kirkland, WA
    Posts
    1,964
    Downloads
    0
    Uploads
    0

    Re: Track Prep for Sebring Feb 22-23 2014

    Exactly. PM or e-mail for pads - IN STOCK and ready for your track season!
    Craig
    425-765-1090, www.Rennstore.com --assistance & discussion for your pad selection welcomed

    PAGID brake pads - Daytona 24 hr winners in every podium position

    GiroDisc brake systems and pad spreaders NOW AVAILABLE - SPECIAL PRICING!



    E-mail for any questions: Rennstore@Comcast.net

  16. #16
    meisme33's Avatar
    meisme33 is offline Porsche Enthusiast
    Join Date
    Feb 2011
    Location
    Florida
    Posts
    201
    Downloads
    8
    Uploads
    0

    Re: Track Prep for Sebring Feb 22-23 2014

    Well, it is upon us. I didn't decide early enough on the pads, so I'm running stock. I did some GoPro testing yesterday and even with the external mic mounted toward the back of the car, wind noise is still a problem. Tonight when I go get gas I'll try one more thing: clipped to the license plate. Supposedly tucked up under there it works quite well. Car needs a quick wipe-down and I need to tape my numbers on. Weather report looks like rain is a real possibility for both days. That is a complete bummer. I'll have to bring garbage bags for my stuff and a couple towels to wipe down the interior if we're running in the rain. I may not even turn Sport on if its wet so I have full PSM nannys intervening on my behalf. Anyone have other microphone placement recommendations? Wet-condition track driving pointers (other than slow down)?

  17. #17
    alasorte's Avatar
    alasorte is offline Porsche Chatter
    Join Date
    Aug 2012
    Location
    Florida
    Posts
    26
    Downloads
    4
    Uploads
    0

    Re: Track Prep for Sebring Feb 22-23 2014

    I'm here at Sebring, too. No rain so far. But if it comes, Sebring in the rain can be fun as long as you're careful (and aren't on slicks). And it can be a learning experience. You can learn a lot about how your car behaves at the edge of adhesion. And at lower speeds than breaking it loose on a dry track. Just be careful!
    2009 Cayman S, PDK, Sport Plus, GT3 master, Pagid Yellows, GiroDiscs

  18. #18
    meisme33's Avatar
    meisme33 is offline Porsche Enthusiast
    Join Date
    Feb 2011
    Location
    Florida
    Posts
    201
    Downloads
    8
    Uploads
    0

    Re: Track Prep for Sebring Feb 22-23 2014

    The results are in! Everything went great and the weather held up nicely. I was happy with the new tires and pressures (I ran 30/31 cold, which ran 36/37 hot) but kept getting the "flat tyre" warning when I started up. The Super Sports are way stickier than the old Bridgestones. The Softronicicon tune seemed to smooth some things out, but what made me faster this time was my experience, the tires, brakes, and alignment. I got bumped up to Blue, but elected to wait until next time so I could stay with my friend in the Green run group. If you can ignore the wind noise, here's some video of me overtaking all of the newbies. And yes, that is a 997TT disappearing in the straights just to lose all of his lead in the turns. My lines aren't perfect in this video (especially turns 1 and 17), but they got much better in the subsequent sessions.
    Last edited by meisme33; 02-25-2014 at 08:49 AM.

  19. #19
    meisme33's Avatar
    meisme33 is offline Porsche Enthusiast
    Join Date
    Feb 2011
    Location
    Florida
    Posts
    201
    Downloads
    8
    Uploads
    0

    Re: Track Prep for Sebring Feb 22-23 2014

    Track Prep for Sebring Feb 22-23 2014-imageuploadedbytapatalk1393340821.309027.jpgTrack Prep for Sebring Feb 22-23 2014-imageuploadedbytapatalk1393340833.439851.jpgTrack Prep for Sebring Feb 22-23 2014-imageuploadedbytapatalk1393340844.539451.jpgTrack Prep for Sebring Feb 22-23 2014-imageuploadedbytapatalk1393340859.078749.jpgTrack Prep for Sebring Feb 22-23 2014-imageuploadedbytapatalk1393340885.452644.jpgTrack Prep for Sebring Feb 22-23 2014-imageuploadedbytapatalk1393340895.213150.jpg

  20. #20
    meisme33's Avatar
    meisme33 is offline Porsche Enthusiast
    Join Date
    Feb 2011
    Location
    Florida
    Posts
    201
    Downloads
    8
    Uploads
    0

    Re: Track Prep for Sebring Feb 22-23 2014

    Track Prep for Sebring Feb 22-23 2014-imageuploadedbytapatalk1393340925.018219.jpgTrack Prep for Sebring Feb 22-23 2014-imageuploadedbytapatalk1393340933.609272.jpgTrack Prep for Sebring Feb 22-23 2014-imageuploadedbytapatalk1393340944.157693.jpgTrack Prep for Sebring Feb 22-23 2014-imageuploadedbytapatalk1393340952.932985.jpgTrack Prep for Sebring Feb 22-23 2014-imageuploadedbytapatalk1393340961.028869.jpgTrack Prep for Sebring Feb 22-23 2014-imageuploadedbytapatalk1393340972.224359.jpg

Page 1 of 2 12 LastLast

Bookmarks

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •