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Thread: Rear toe links?

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    sean is offline Porsche Enthusiast
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    Rear toe links?

    So the shop managed to destroy my toe link while doing a simple rear tire replacement. Is there an aftermarket replacement I should go with or is the factory one the best?


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    tach miami's Avatar
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    Re: Rear toe links?

    The TPCicon links are adjustable.
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    Re: Rear toe links?

    Sean,

    Call Ira at Tarett Engineering (Tarett Engineering). He sells adjustable toe links (AKA track rods) through his site, but give him a call just to chat.

    If you decide you want to go OEM I think I still have a set with maybe 15K miles on them that you are welcome to.

    Where in CA are you located?

    Cheers,
    A
    www.caymanspec.com


    Vision Motorsports - Fikse - JRZ - Tarett - MantisSport

  4. #4
    sean is offline Porsche Enthusiast
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    Re: Rear toe links?

    Interesting. I might do that. I figured since I need to replace them, I might as well upgrade...but I only need one (I think).

    I'm in Sherman Oaks.

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    Re: Rear toe links?

    The stock links are adjusted by an eccentric screw at the in-board end. Under very high cornering loads these can slip and you lose your toe alignment. After market links use a turnbuckle style adjustment which is more secure. If you intend to track the car, I would get the after market links. Rear camber and toe are related, if one changes, the other changes. If you run a lot of negative camber (required on a track car), you may run out of toe adjustment and after market links can help. If the car is only used on the street, the stock links should be fine.

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    sean is offline Porsche Enthusiast
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    Re: Rear toe links?

    I track the car semi-regularly. That being said, the shop wants to buy the links and do the work themselves, which is understandable, so I'm betting Krokodil will be getting a call shortly.

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    Re: Rear toe links?

    If they can not change a rear tire without breaking something, what makes you think they can replace a rear toe link properly? By the way you will need a four wheel alignment after the rear toe link(s) is(are) replaced.
    Having fun in Puerto Rico

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    sean is offline Porsche Enthusiast
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    Re: Rear toe links?

    Cuz I'm going to stand there and make sure they do it right.

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    berty987 is offline Porsche Activist
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    Re: Rear toe links?

    There is no rubber bushing in the TPCicon item and the ball joint looks substantially smaller. A lot of racing equipment is designed more for adjustability than durability. I think without the rubber bushing the TPC item would give a much more uncomfortable ride over road surfaces with the ball joint taking a lot of punishment. May well be of benefit on the track but not something i'd want on my road car. As to the idea of the eccentric bolts slipping , this seems crazy as its the same design employed on the GT3 which really is a track orientated car. If you are serious about track driving you should be checking and setting the geo for each circuit anyway.

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    Re: Rear toe links?

    Quote Originally Posted by berty987 View Post
    There is no rubber bushing in the TPCicon item and the ball joint looks substantially smaller. A lot of racing equipment is designed more for adjustability than durability. I think without the rubber bushing the TPC item would give a much more uncomfortable ride over road surfaces with the ball joint taking a lot of punishment. May well be of benefit on the track but not something i'd want on my road car. As to the idea of the eccentric bolts slipping , this seems crazy as its the same design employed on the GT3 which really is a track orientated car. If you are serious about track driving you should be checking and setting the geo for each circuit anyway.
    Though the TPCRacing Adjustable Toe Links are physically smaller than the OEM units, you must take into account that our units are constructed from forged pieces of material. On the other hand the factory pieces are cast, which means that they would need to be bigger to carry the same loads as the forged pieces. Also, while the factory piece does appear bigger, you must also consider that it has an H-Beam design that makes it appear to contain more material than it actually does.

    As far as the rodends on the toe links are concerned; we use only top quality Aurora rodends on our toe links. Those in the know, know that Aurora makes the best rodends money can buy; there is nothing stronger, more reliable, or so well manufactured. Because under normal driving conditions vehicles would experience very little dramatic lateral load changes, the driver should never notice the difference between the stock units and ours. The benefit of having these solid rodends is that during high performance driving, particularly high load cornering, the solid joint provides a much more solid consistent feedback to the driver, improving vehicle control throughout the turn, improving entrance/middle/exit speed. Under normal driving conditions these rodends should be reliable for many years.

    As with any components on racecars, when subjected to extreme driving conditions, they will need to be replaced occasionally to continue to provide peak performance. This is part of the cost of racing. However, because of our multi-piece design, rodends can easily be replaced as they go bad. We do not have a recommended replacement interval for these rodends because their survival is very much dependent on the setup of each individual car as well as the driving conditions they see. If you are a smooth driver who stays off the curbs and on track their car on nice smooth track surfaces on street tires, then your toe links would obviously last much longer than someone driving a GT3 Cup or a track focused car on slicks. That would generate much higher lateral G loads than the street car. On our Grand Am 24 Hour of Daytona winning car, a set of toe links was able to survive the entire 24 hours as well as the next 5 races. And that is on a car with full Michelin slicks and pro drivers wringing every last MPH out of it.

    Toe Link longevity also is hugely dependent upon how often you decide to cut the grass when you go out to the track.

    Adjustable toe links also provide the advantage of being able to correct the alignment on lowered cars, extending tire life, and providing a wider range of adjustment for your on-track excursions.

    As far as this issue with slipping eccentric bolts goes; When properly tightened, these bolts should not budge. They are on our Pro GT3 Cup Cars, and we never have an issue with them. Just crank them down good and tight and you will be fine. If you notice them slipping....then you didn't tighten them enough!!!

    It good to see some good discussion on Toe Links....one of the more under appreciated suspension components.

  11. #11
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    Re: Rear toe links?

    Quote Originally Posted by Josh@TPCRACING View Post
    ...Those in the know, know that Aurora makes the best rodends money can buy; there is nothing stronger, more reliable, or so well manufactured.....
    With all due respect... Aurora makes very nice rod-ends. I typically use them (at work) when/if cost is a factor. However, from my experience, there are others that are higher quality and that have a longer life. NMB, NHBB, and Goldline are examples - however, sometimes cost gets truly ridiculous.

    Again, I think Aurora bearings are very good; in fact they are what I would spec if I had designed your toe links. I just don't enjoy when people make sweeping statements. The truth is there are many strong competitors for most products - especially aerospace-based ones like rod-ends.

    I also agree that your toe-links shouldn't affect ride and may make handling a bit more stable on-track. They also obviously afford a broader range of toe adjustment. The biggest side-effect I would expect on the street is a small increase in noise level.

    I also agree the eccentrics should not slip when tightened properly.

    No offense intended, and best regards,

    Jeff

  12. #12
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    Re: Rear toe links?

    Quote Originally Posted by tach miami View Post
    The TPCicon links are adjustable.
    +1, what I got

  13. #13
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    Re: Rear toe links?

    Quote Originally Posted by Jeff G in NE GA View Post
    With all due respect... Aurora makes very nice rod-ends. I typically use them (at work) when/if cost is a factor. However, from my experience, there are others that are higher quality and that have a longer life. NMB, NHBB, and Goldline are examples - however, sometimes cost gets truly ridiculous.

    Again, I think Aurora bearings are very good; in fact they are what I would spec if I had designed your toe links. I just don't enjoy when people make sweeping statements. The truth is there are many strong competitors for most products - especially aerospace-based ones like rod-ends.

    I also agree that your toe-links shouldn't affect ride and may make handling a bit more stable on-track. They also obviously afford a broader range of toe adjustment. The biggest side-effect I would expect on the street is a small increase in noise level.

    I also agree the eccentrics should not slip when tightened properly.

    No offense intended, and best regards,

    Jeff

    Jeff,

    Don't worry, no offense taken here. I do realize that my statement was a little broad. I should have said, that for our application, there is no part better suited. They are a little pricey however not enough to drive up our cost for our customers. While we could use even stronger pieces, they would simply be overkill, and would drastically increase the costs that get passed along to the customer.

    You guys sure do pay attention....thanks for not letting me get away with anything.

    Josh

  14. #14
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    Re: Rear toe links?

    wow... josh really gets excited about toe links
    Casey Parkin : Washington, DC

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    Jeff G in NE GA's Avatar
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    Re: Rear toe links?

    Thanks guys. We're all on the same page now.

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    Re: Rear toe links?

    Great thread, this is why I come to this site.
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    Re: Rear toe links?


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