Planet 9

mrmiatanut · #1 11-16-2011, 10:58 AM

Trey Walker V8 Porsche Boxster Grenada Autocross 11/6/11 In Car - YouTube

DMN987S · #2 11-16-2011, 11:02 AM

Sure sounds like a winner!

wulfgang · #3 11-16-2011, 07:05 PM

Are you actually ever going to post details of your project, or are you just going to keep pimping your video on 16 different forums?

I can't help but feel like you owe the forums a bit because I know you got helpful information from forums to get your build started. And yet I have seen you refuse to provide any details to other people who are interested in doing such a swap.

Please prove that I am wrong about you.

mrmiatanut · #4 11-16-2011, 07:27 PM

If someone is interested in me performing a swap, I'd be more than happy to provide some information. Until I get the car completely sorted out and road worthy, I'm not going to post much more. I've spent a very long time working on this and find out what works and what doesn't. To my knowledge this is the FIRST actual running V8 Boxster in the world. I'd be glad to provide more info, once the check clears. I'm a very down to earth guy and I work very hard for what I have, but that allows me to play even harder.

As to owing anything to anyone, I'm not sure where you get your information. I know only one other person that has accomplished what I have done and he doesn't get his info from the forums either, we have worked very closely on our Boxsters together and he feels the same way that I do about just giving out information. This has been going on for almost two years now and I've spent a bunch of hard earned money out of my pocket to make this a reality.

I've seen your posts about wanting to do the swap, but to my knowledge it never happened. Anyone can get a tape measure out and measure the engines and engine bays....... But I don't know anyone that actually has one running and driving.....

Unfortunately, I'm not in a position to go get a new Cayman S or Boxster S for that matter. So I did the next best thing and engineered my own modern day hot rod. In the end, I am much happier with the results knowing that I made this all happen with my own two hands vs going down to the local dealer and picking up a new slow porsche. Otherwise, I wouldn't own one. I'd just stick to cruising around in my 89 Miata and be content....

wulfgang · #5 11-16-2011, 07:54 PM

Originally Posted by mrmiatanut

Anyone can get a tape measure out and measure the engines and engine bays.

Exactly. And anyone can get out a camera and snap photos of their build, write posts about what they did and how they did it, etc. It doesn't take much effort, just a willingness to give back to the community.

I'd love to hear you brag about your build on this FREE community forum or on any of the other 6+ threads where you have posted your video and refused to answer questions.

Btw, if you're looking to sell info, then I think you have to become a sponsor of this forum first.

rsg · #6 11-16-2011, 07:56 PM

This thread is useless without details. You were better off not posting it.

**K-Man S** · #7 11-16-2011, 08:27 PM

I have to concur with Wulfgang, you could certainly tell more about what you've done to the car than showing a video of a not very impressive autox run ($100 says I can beat that time in my lowly flat 6 Cayman but I digress)

It would be pretty easy to say something like

"I used a Chevy 305 V8 out of a 1998 Camaro and did a custom adapter plate to the transmission. We also installed the ECU from the Camaro to control the engine. etc. etc." and that wouldn't give away any "secret sauce" or allow someone else to just run out and do it themselves. I don't think anyone was asking for every last detail of the project only the general information you might get in a magazine article, etc.

As far as anyone else want you to do an install for them, if you want to advertise your services on this site, then yes you need to become a sponsor. If you need help with that let me know.

I applaud you for your efforts and taking the plunge on such an endeavor but if you are looking to showcase your work, then yes you do need to provide some more info or you are only going to piss people off on a web forum. Just the way it works... imagine if you went to a car club meeting and told people you had a V8 in your Boxster and they said "Let me see!" and you said "Sorry can't raise the hood and show you, top secret and all" I don't think you'd make too many friends at the car club meeting...

mrmiatanut · #8 11-16-2011, 08:56 PM

Hey Guys,
I'm glad y'all find this so interesting. I'm not trying to hide anything. I've posted all this info on other forums, including a pic of the engine in the car. I have been taking it to local car shows and I pop the cover off the engine all the time to show it off. I've seen wulfgang on other forums where I have posted all this info, so I just figured he knew what I had done.

To fill everyone in here. It's a 99 Audi A8 4.2 being run by an AEM race box. I built custom engine and transmission mounts. Had a custom flywheel and special clutch made. Everything functions in the Boxster. All the gauges, cruise control, A/C, and even ABS. I was able to fully integrate the AEM back into the porsche chassis wiring to control everything.

As of this moment, all the tuning has been done in the parking lot at my shop. I'm working on fine tuning a few more things on the car before I take it to an actual tuner and pay to have it tuned on a dyno.

I'm attaching a pic of the engine compartment, don't say I never threw my dog a bone.....

Dunebasher · #9 11-17-2011, 02:14 AM

Originally Posted by DMN987S

Sure sounds like a winner!

+1 sounds great!

The Audi 4.2 is a great motor and looks like a nice project.

Gotsol · #10 11-17-2011, 07:35 AM

great project! Also, where is that autocross course? that looks like a nice venue to let the Boxster stretch its legs.

wulfgang · #11 11-17-2011, 07:49 AM

I don't mean to be greedy, but... throw some more bones! Seriously, I saw that pic months ago. Break out the camera, man.

I'm specifically interested in why you made new transmission mounts. The front mount obviously had to be custom, but why the tranny mounts? Is it because you had to move the transmission back a bit to clear the top of the intake manifold?

I'm sure people on several forums would also like to know which specific combo of flywheel, clutch disc, and clutch cover you ended up using, and if you had to use a spacer like the guys using the 01x transmissions. Especially the kit car people. They may not care about your Boxster setup, but if there's a cheap flywheel/clutch option to fit up a 986 5-speed to the 4.2 V8s, then the mid-engined kit people are going to love it.

For anyone who did not already know... the Audi 4.2L V8 has the same bell housing bolt pattern as the base model 986 as well as the 6-speed on the Cayman S. The engine is very short lengthwise, as short as our M96/97 engines, is much narrower than our engines, but is about 2" taller overall. In addition, the V8 has the crankshaft lower in the block than our H6 (obvious, maybe). The upshot is that the engine fits in the engine bay, but it lowers the rest of the driveline a bit. And something has to be done about the front engine mount, because there isn't a place to mount it to the Audi V8. The early 986 doesn't have CAN or electronic throttle, and so the wiring is more old school (much easier) than it would be on a newer 986 or 987.

As for specs, it looks like mrmiatanut has the 32-valve V8, which was something like 250-290 hp from the factory, depending on the year. The later 40-valvers were 310-330 hp. With intake/exhaust work, people are getting them to 350+ relatively easily.

In short, it's a great swap for a 1997-1999 Boxster, but the returns diminish greatly and the difficulty would go way up if you already have a 987.

wulfgang · #12 11-17-2011, 07:50 AM

Oh, also interested in what you did with the air box. Can you change the filter without dropping the engine?

mrmiatanut · #13 11-17-2011, 10:39 AM

The autocross course is in Grenada, Mississippi at the Grenada Airport. They have a very nice large chunk of concrete for parking large planes. This area is no longer used for such and they let the MS Region, MSSCCA, use this space several times a year. Most of the cars were hitting the rev limiter in 2nd that day. I was about halfway through 3rd. I had to run it in 3rd or else the car got sideways real quick. I'm still running the stock suspension and old stock dry rotted tires. The Boxster has been sitting up for almost 2 years.

K-Man, I agree, it wasn't a stellar autocross run. I'm not the fastest driver in the world. I just enjoy getting out there and having fun. This was the first time that the car has been ever driven at speed with the V8. The engine has yet to be tuned and the car has yet to be sorted out. Once all is said and done, I'll get a professional driver to autocross and track the car to see what it can really do.

Wulfgang, I have been taking a bunch of pics the last couple of years. Don't worry, everyone will get to see them sooner or later. I'm working on building a website to showcase everything, but that's still several months from launching. I'm still experimenting with different components on the engine and I want to make sure everything it working 100% before I reveal much more.

I can tell you this. We've tried a wide combination of flywheels and clutches. We ended up designing our own flywheel in cad and had a local machinist mill it. We wanted to make sure we had something that works properly for this application and will hold up to the abuse.

This is the 32 Valve motor in my car. My friends Boxster is running a 40 Valve 4.2.

B8_RDC · #14 11-21-2011, 10:58 PM

Hats off to you on getting it to fit and run. Any particular reason why you would challenge yourself with such a "low reward" move vs. custom turbo kit? Seems like you must of put much more blood, sweat n dollars into getting the V8 in there vs. going power adder.

If challenge was your goal then I can understand.

007ballah · #15 11-26-2011, 10:14 AM

I'm guessing the v8 swap was because the Audi motor was only $900 I think, right? and the there are questions about how much those 986 engines can handle in terms of boosting power methods. Sorry, thought I'd chime in and see if I was close to correct.

mrmiatanut · #16 11-26-2011, 05:04 PM

Originally Posted by B8_RDC

Hats off to you on getting it to fit and run. Any particular reason why you would challenge yourself with such a "low reward" move vs. custom turbo kit? Seems like you must of put much more blood, sweat n dollars into getting the V8 in there vs. going power adder.

If challenge was your goal then I can understand.

I can give you a number of reasons why I would perform such a "low reward" swap:

1) My Boxster with the V8 cost a fraction of your cayman s
2) My V8 Boxster will definitely out run a stock cayman s
3) Forced induction on a 2.5 boxster engine is a ticking time bomb
4) A stock n/a 2.5 engine is a ticking time bomb in itself
5) If the V8 does go out, I can get a decent used engine for less than $1000
6) There is no replacement for displacement
7) Who else do you know that has a V8 Boxster?

rsg · #17 11-26-2011, 06:31 PM

A custom turbo would eat your "winner" day in and day out without any extensive modification that would put the value of the car in the shitter. Plus it would be easily reversible.

bxstr · #18 11-26-2011, 07:50 PM

Don't think you will be getting any engine failures anytime soon.

clint.spann · #19 11-26-2011, 09:05 PM

mrmiatanut, admire your work. Cool project.

Personally I think a Flat 6 belongs in these cars. Just feels right.

"6) There is no replacement for displacement"

I hate this quote. There is a replacement...it's gearing and revs

F1 is currently using 2.4L V8's and produce 750HP+...yeah, they are extreme...but, you get the idea...a huge engine in a lightweight F1 race car would be stupid

cbzzoom · #20 11-26-2011, 10:04 PM

Originally Posted by clint.spann

"6) There is no replacement for displacement"

I hate this quote. There is a replacement...it's gearing and revs

Urg, you got that right. And those people who think high torque is so great... my tractor has 400 lb-ft of torque but it ain't fast. Power to weight is just about the only thing that matters.

Anyhoo, there are lots of other reasons to love a V8 in a pre-DFI Boxster or Cayman.

The Audi and the LS1 are both very cheap, very reliable, about the same weight and size. Great solid engines. They are definitely a big upgrade over stock. And early roller boxsters are getting super cheap. It's a great way to build a monster track car for example.

If there was a reputable shop doing clean, reliable boxster V8 builds I for one would be interested.

DFI

Direct Fuel Injection (DFI), is a new technology that Porsche states can cut fuel consumption by up to 15 percent, while increasing power by up to 13 percent. DFI cuts emissions by warming up the catalytic converter more quickly, and ensures a sharper throttle response. Better for your right foot - and the planet, then.

DFI allows much more precise measurement of fuel supply and injection at pressures up to 120 bar; it has numerous combustion modes, with different cycles for cold-starting, low-speed driving and performance driving.

As the name suggests, DFI injects fuel directly into the individual combustion chambers, instead of the intake manifold. The injector valves have an electromagnetic mechanism that controls each injection with astonishing precision, while a high-pressure pump provides the necessary pressure—up to 1,740 psi—to accompany the rapid fire of the fuel injection.

Precise geometry of the injector’s position and its spray pattern is a key factor in helping to improve power, torque and emissions of the engines. The specific placement of the fuel as it enters each chamber creates a swirl that improves the air/fuel mixture, and therefore the overall combustion process.

At engine speeds up to 3500 rpm, a double-injection process is used. In this mode, the required fuel volume is delivered in two successive injections per working stroke. The resulting benefits include faster catalyst warm-up and increased torque in the upper load range.

By forming the air/fuel mix directly in the combustion chamber, DFI contributes to engine cooling. As a result, it is possible to increase the compression ratio and with it the power and efficiency of the engine.

The direct injection process is continuously adjusted. The engine management system reads changes to throttle inputs and performance requirements and, as you drive, the air/fuel mix is monitored and adapted as required. Oxygen sensor circuits within the exhaust system provide accurate emissions control.