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    Re: Would You Buy an Electric Boxster/Cayman?

    On a tangent for a bit: those (25?) ICE Gibson engines in the LMP2 cars at LeMans did pretty well surviving 24 hours compared to the 6 LMP1 hybrid cars.
    Last edited by 1028Caymn; 06-18-2017 at 04:35 PM.

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    Re: Would You Buy an Electric Boxster/Cayman?

    Quote Originally Posted by engnr1 View Post
    Indian? Old or new?
    Would love to have an older one, but I'm happy with my 2015 Scout.
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    Re: Would You Buy an Electric Boxster/Cayman?

    Quote Originally Posted by black987 View Post
    I'm one of those "global warming" crowd. I'm also one of those "the earth is round and travels around the sun" crowd. ... It's only a matter of time before us obese, arrogant, pompous, we-know-best Americans fall inline with the rest of the world and start to ride bikes more often, drive more fuel efficient/electric cars, and use cleaner fuel sources.
    You might misunderstand. I take no sides on that issue and have repeatedly said the EU is finished. In time, they will ban all IC, they have set their course. OTH, Facts are Facts, something the climate "scientists" like to say, and US sales of pickups and SUVs are greater than ever. As noted above, the EPA is being gutted and a reversal of policy is ongoing.

    These are facts, nothing more. Its how the US public spends its money (and it appears CA as well), just as its fact the EU is going in a different direction as noted by the EU Parliaments making Paris binding on member states and upping their requirements from 2020 to 2018. What I dont understand is why those with a passion for "global warming" always sound so angry. What's with that? Its not like they can do anything about it by being angry.

    I am in the middle, taking no opinion either way but am looking only at sales figures, statutes, and policies. These change as the money flow changes, for example as tax credits go away ... bye bye, there is no longer any incentive. Couple this with dirt cheap gas prices and they will be a distant memory in the US public, an experiment that didn't get too far. Of course, that can change with a catastrophic event.

    BTW, if a BAT is implemented, you can kiss all imports goodbye unless you are wealthy as well as some components of Detroit cars. But the probability of a BAT being implemented, or of Joe Public understanding it without a course in it, is probably small at this point. For we enthusiasts, that would not be a good thing as it would effect all our parts, repairs, tires, etc. And if a BAT comes into place for EV Sports Cars? ROFL, they will sell none other than to the super rich celebrities (IMO).

    Quote Originally Posted by 1028Caymn View Post
    On a tangent for a bit: those (24?) ICE Gibson engines in the LMP2 cars in LeMans did pretty well surviving 24 hours compared to the 6 LMP1 hybrid cars.
    I noted they made a point about one if the 919s unable to make it to the pits after an oil problem only on the battery. And that is a problem I think Joe Public will definitely worry about. No place to plug in and stranded with the family? What to do? get a tow to where?
    Last edited by chows4us; 06-18-2017 at 04:46 PM.

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    Re: Would You Buy an Electric Boxster/Cayman?

    What I dont understand is why those with a passion for "global warming" always sound so angry. What's with that? Its not like they can do anything about it by being angry.
    It's because all "global warming" advocates are Progressives, and Progressives have been angry since November 9 when Hillary conceded.

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    I'm never buying an electric Porsche, but I might buy one as a cheap beater, if it can drive for me on a pub crawl and take me home.
    I'm not buying any hybrids either, as long as they continue to add a cost and weight penalty, without added excitement. Hybrids might be OK for around town delivery vehicles, but they typically add 400 lbs of dead weight and do nothing to save fuel driving on an Interstate highway at the speed limit (or 10-15 over).
    As far as the climate change risk, the next risk is a drop in the earth's temperature. Climate change is mostly and hugely driven by geologic and by moon and solar system gravitational forces, and by astronomical events. Short and long term solar cycle effects are more significant that human activity. Reversing of the earth's magnetic field is another huge unknown wild card.
    And lest some forget, human activity on this planet is not unnatural. One weird religion (I'll refrain from naming it) would have us believe that humans here evolved from garbage left on the earth long ago by aliens. But the leaders of this religion are uber-rich and also believe the vast majority of us are garbage.
    So, can we leave beliefs out of the discussions?
    Thanks, and enjoy your Porsches!

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    Re: Would You Buy an Electric Boxster/Cayman?

    Quote Originally Posted by fast1 View Post
    It's because all "global warming" advocates are Progressives, and Progressives have been angry since November 9 when Hillary conceded.
    My question is legit. Every time I hear global warming people talk, they are angry and I don't know why, regardless of political affiliation. Lets not discuss politics, thank u

    Quote Originally Posted by PCA1983 View Post
    Reversing of the earth's magnetic field is another huge unknown wild card.
    I hate when that happens. I don't want to have to go buy another compass. The good ones aren't cheap. And its bound to mess up the GPS unit. You know how much a new PCM cost installed???

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    Re: Would You Buy an Electric Boxster/Cayman?

    Quote Originally Posted by chows4us View Post
    So how about those electric Boxsters? Anyone going to buy one? Guess real hard. Does anyone even see the slightest market for one in NA?
    I could see them selling in California. Silicon Valley is full of people who are affluent, liberal, and interested in the latest technology. Los Angeles has a lot of people who are affluent, liberal, want to seem stylish and trendy, and who enjoy driving with the top down. Combine that with the California ZEV mandate and the fact that it's the largest auto market in the US, and that's not an insignificant niche.

    Outside of California, I could imagine them selling in a handful of coastal cities that are affluent, liberal, and have a lot of people working in tech -- like Boston, Seattle, and Austin. Maybe DC, though of course I'm talking about well-paid lawyers, lobbyists, consultants, and contractors, not civil servants.

    Beyond that -- not so much.

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    Re: Would You Buy an Electric Boxster/Cayman?

    Every time I witness or participate in discussions that go sideways like this one, it re-confirms my belief that it's time for another species to have a crack at it.
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    Re: Would You Buy an Electric Boxster/Cayman?

    Quote Originally Posted by gcurnew View Post
    Every time I witness or participate in discussions that go sideways like this one, it re-confirms my belief that it's time for another species to have a crack at it.
    Another outlandish, irrelevant, pointless post.

    Cheers

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    Re: Would You Buy an Electric Boxster/Cayman?

    Quote Originally Posted by ralarcon View Post
    Another outlandish, irrelevant, pointless post.

    Cheers
    You mean like the one you just posted?
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    Re: Would You Buy an Electric Boxster/Cayman?

    Quote Originally Posted by black987 View Post
    You mean like the one you just posted?

    No, like yours

    Cheers

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    Re: Would You Buy an Electric Boxster/Cayman?

    Knock it off you guys. Keep the discussion on electric sports cars, not personal attacks. You know the rules. An EV sports car discussion is bound to be a discussion on ALL EV and their place in society. Just stay away from the politics please (statistics, laws, etc are fine, not advocacy for parties).

    RoninX, sure maybe some celebrities will buy a handful of electric 718. Their general sales in the US is already less than stellar falling behind the 987 and 981 at the same time in the production cycles. I would not consider a few outliers to be a "market", not a general market. I assume you mean will sales stay the same as today. That is why the turbos are a intermediate step to hybrid or EV. Imagine if they just jumped to EV. The sales numbers speak for themselves. Add a BAT to the imports, which is NOT a done deal by any means, and no one but the very rich will buy an imported EV anything.

    But here is what will kill them entirely (except for the extremes). The financial news discussed the glut of oil this morning. Here is the historical price of gas https://energy.gov/eere/vehicles/fac...rice-1929-2015 The last time gas was at $1 was the late 80s but consistently not since 1979. 86 cent gas in 1979 is $3.08 gas today. Todays gas is $2.30. We are already below 1979 gas prices adjusted for inflation and the expectation could be $2 gas for the summer. But that's just the beginning. There is a glut of gas, more than they know what to do with. Between Fracking and the massive oil reserves opened up in the Arctic, there was even talk of $1 gas sometime in the future.

    Anybody here remember $1 gas? Just look at the inflation adjusted prices here https://energy.gov/eere/vehicles/fac...rice-1929-2015 If gas falls below $1.47 today, it will be the lowest in recorded history for the US. The LOWEST. Wasn't gas selling for less than $2? Yes it was in March, 2016 See https://www.eia.gov/dnav/pet/hist/Le...TE_NUS_DPG&f=W If this vast resource of oil is allowed to come to market, since the artificial constraints have been lifted, it should be obvious this will about kill EV for the US (and CA). SUV and Pickup sales, which just continue to rise and rise. Will shoot out of sight. And Tesla and the EV?

    The suggestion on the financial channel was to turn away from batteries and instead focus the money and resources in that industry toward making the burning of oil "cleaner" because despite the alarmists telling us we were running out of all since oil was first used in the mid-1800s, there is far more of it and they keep discovering more and getting it out off the ground cheaper.

    Imagine $1.47 gas and the CHEAPEST gas in the history of the US (Adjusted for inflation). That's staggering and, IMO, would just devastate the EV industry.

    Will anyone buy an EV Box/Cay. Of course their are extremest on both side of the curve but the middle of the curve is what matters and I expect no, unless mandated by law, there will none but the "cool kids with the cash". You noted Outside of California, I could imagine them selling in a handful of coastal cities that are affluent, liberal, and have a lot of people working in tech -- like Boston, Seattle, and Austin. Maybe DC, though of course I'm talking about well-paid lawyers, lobbyists, consultants, and contractors, not civil servants.

    A state, like CA, can of course pass any law. They could ban all IC from being sold. I'm not sure if they could ban IC cars driving through the state but probably/maybe cars being sold within the state. So the question then becomes, if you can only buy EV in CA, who will buy Boxsters? I would refer that back to the psychographic profile of Porsche buyers which includes Elites, jet setters and the like and sure, the rich celebrities might. Not so sure about the auto enthusiasts, trophy hunters, or garage queens. Being outside of DC, the number of true EV I have seen in the wild is two (2) (one Tesla, one Fiskar). All I see are Pickups, a mountain of SUVs, and the usual rare Ferrari, Lambo, some Porsches, and another mountain of Prius, Corollas, Hondas, and leased BMWs. This observation is, of course, anecdotal. YMMV.

    Do NOT underestimate the power of $$$. Cheap GAS = death of EV in the current policy environment.
    Last edited by chows4us; 06-19-2017 at 12:17 PM.

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    Re: Would You Buy an Electric Boxster/Cayman?

    When I first got my license regular gas was between $.28 and $.31 a gallon, and there were occasional price wars. I remember getting a set of six glasses from an Esso dealer. You had to have proof of purchase for 50 gallons to get the glasses. Finally, they use to have gas attendants back then who pumped the gas, cleaned your windshield, and checked your oil level. All for $.28 a gallon.
    Last edited by fast1; 06-19-2017 at 11:15 AM.

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    Re: Would You Buy an Electric Boxster/Cayman?

    Quote Originally Posted by fast1 View Post
    When I first got my license regular gas was between $.28 and $.31 a gallon, and there were occasional price wars. I remember getting a set of six glasses from an Esso dealer. You had to have proof of purchase for 50 gallons to get the glasses. Finally, they use to have gas attendants back then who pumped the gas, cleaned your windshield, and checked your oil level. All for $.28 a gallon.
    I remember that stuff. I recall $.35 a gallon for Hi-Test and you get a glass with every purchase. I still have a couple of those smoked glass glasses. This was in So Cal in the late sixties early seventies.
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    Re: Would You Buy an Electric Boxster/Cayman?

    Quote Originally Posted by MidLifeCrisis View Post
    I remember that stuff. I recall $.35 a gallon for Hi-Test and you get a glass with every purchase. I still have a couple of those smoked glass glasses. This was in So Cal in the late sixties early seventies.

    They use to also have road maps back then which they would give you for the asking. Not many people using maps nowadays.

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    Re: Would You Buy an Electric Boxster/Cayman?

    Yup. 35.9 was the price in Ohio and we used to dig thru the seat cushions to come up with a bucks worth of change. Good to go for the night.

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    Re: Would You Buy an Electric Boxster/Cayman?

    Agree with all. $1.50 gas will do severe damage. $1 gas will devastate the EV market in the US. I remember the gas "wars", between gas stations across the street, and green stamps.



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    Re: Would You Buy an Electric Boxster/Cayman?

    Whenever electric vehicles come up, it seems most of the discussion goes towards efficiency, environment, and cost. When I think of an electric vehicle, I think about the perf implications. 100% torque at 0 rpm. Individually controlled motors allow for true torque vectoring instead of using brakes. Less moving parts. From my perspective, we're still early in the generation of electric performance vehicles. The Rimac Concept One is interesting, but at one extreme end. The original Tesla Roadster was interesting. Something in between the two could be something I would buy as an addition.
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    Re: Would You Buy an Electric Boxster/Cayman?

    Quote Originally Posted by chows4us View Post
    Agree with all. $1.50 gas will do severe damage. $1 gas will devastate the EV market in the US. I remember the gas "wars", between gas stations across the street, and green stamps.



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    Re: Would You Buy an Electric Boxster/Cayman?

    Quote Originally Posted by fast1 View Post
    When I first got my license regular gas was between $.28 and $.31 a gallon, and there were occasional price wars. I remember getting a set of six glasses from an Esso dealer. You had to have proof of purchase for 50 gallons to get the glasses. Finally, they use to have gas attendants back then who pumped the gas, cleaned your windshield, and checked your oil level. All for $.28 a gallon.
    I remember growing up in the 70s with the fear of $1/gallon gas. Until the mid-70s all the stations had giveaways and full service. Funny thing is, New Jersey still has full service! And I worked and/or lived in Dubai from 2001 to 2014, and they still had full-service attendants, $1.25/gallon, and free bottles of water during summer (except during Ramadan).


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