Planet 9

**drvreg** · #41 06-26-2007, 07:16 PM

Originally Posted by K-Man S

Ok and to my point at times in that video your left arm (9 o'clock starting position) is all the way over at 3 o'clock, 180 degrees around the wheel and in a sense upside down. Unless you have wrists that swivel 360 degrees I just don't see how the grip on the wheel can be as effective against sudden movements or strong feedback through the wheel as a pair of shifted hands could/would be. Could you unwind faster? Yeah probably so.

Ever watch F1? They go full lock in the low speed corners and they don't seem to have any problem controlling the car. Let's take the hairpin for example. If I'm fully crossed making the right hand turn, I'll NEVER try to add more right turn. If the car gets loose, I'll be unwinding the wheel - not adding more steering!

Try it out in a few corners Ken - see how it feels to you.
I wouldn't do it myself and wouldn't recommend it to you if I didn't think it would help!

Originally Posted by K-Man S

I also watched you take your hand off the wheel for awhile at times for shifting, and I know I'm guilty of that at times but I really try to get it off and back on the wheel asap, a couple of times you seemed to be lingering on the ole shifter.

I know exactly where you're talking about - between turns 10 & 11. In a nutshell, I'm out of gear in that corner. I usually try to have the shift down BEFORE the turn. It get's pretty busy in there!
I might have been guilty of leaving my hand on the shifter when going down two gears. ...gonna gave to to watch that. I know I never let students get away with that.

Originally Posted by K-Man S

Last, but not least, what did you remove your left hand for that one time?

That was to give a point-by. In that run group point-bys are not required. I was signaling to the other driver I was going to leave the door open for him if he wanted to take it.

Originally Posted by K-Man S

passing on the left and right? that's crazy stuff!!!

PBOC's "SuperSolo" program is a blast. Open passing, point-by's not required! It's the most fun I've had in a car with my pants on.

**type997** · #42 06-26-2007, 07:34 PM

Great video Ken! Now I know why I get my doors blown off at the track. I never knew you could run a Porsche that close to redline for so long. How long can you run like that? until the engine temp starts rising?

**K-Man S** · #43 06-26-2007, 08:25 PM

Originally Posted by type987s

Great video Ken! Now I know why I get my doors blown off at the track. I never knew you could run a Porsche that close to redline for so long. How long can you run like that? until the engine temp starts rising?

Engine temps never varied all day long. I can run like that until I get a code 302 (first time ever btw) otherwise day after day after day...

**K-Man S** · #44 06-26-2007, 08:26 PM

drvreg - F1? Come on the steering wheels in F1 are what 6" side to side? I'm surprised people don't one-hand it and hold their latte at the same time...

**Craig@Rennstore.com** · #45 06-26-2007, 08:50 PM

K-Man

Once you've conditioned yourself to driving without moving your hands off the wheel, it's actually much easier to drive fast.
It truly is more than some anecdotal 'my driving instructor told me so' type of thing.

Imagine a left-hand turn.
Right hand goes to the left over top, thumb portion pointing down.
Left hand becomes a 'thumb controlled hold' on the previous 9:00 wheel spoke which is now at 3:00

The steering on my car is extremely heavy, with no power steering, bags of negative camber, and 275 front / 315 rear Kumho V710 tires.

Not a problem, ever in 9 years - I promise!

EBMCS03 · #46 06-27-2007, 11:30 PM

Sweet! More videos! I really enjoy them. THANKS!

**JackWood** · #47 06-28-2007, 03:31 PM

Ken, I have to concur with the other guys. My driver-training is obviously less extensive than yours, but has all been with Porsche instructors. They have always drummed thumbs locked at 9/3.
I had been reading up prior to my last outing, and about not gripping the wheel tight (I never do, but made an effort to be even more relaxed) and the instructor (I always try to have the same one) pulled me up on it immidiately for being too loose a grip and wanted my thumbs locked in, not resting on the bumps.
He always states there should never be any reason to shuffle hands. A 180 rotation is perfectly acceptable.
His stated reasons are 2-fold. 1) Most important, you have a CONSTENT relationship between wheel and wheels. ie at ALL times you know EXACTLY what directions your wheels are pointed in. It means in any circumstance or unforseen circumstance you can put in exactly the right corrective input without having to "guess" where the wheels are pointing. 2) you are never caught with one hand off the wheel in an unforseen circumstance.

As for the comments on wheel size, with a smaller wheel, it is even harder to control with the 9/3 position as a) a smaller movement produces more input, making the stering feel sharper and b) the steering is heavier because of the reduced moment of the smaller wheel diameter.

RE the seat position, it might make it harder with the GT3 seats because of no rear tilt. I have to have my seat very up-right to still get a slight bent arm touching the top of the wheel with my palms (impossible to do 180 locked-thumb rotation without having this distance between shoulder and wheel right) and still have my legs in the right position for clutch. Felt unnatural at first, but now, like many things, is second nature and I always feel in total control.

Jack

PS, can't play any of the vids. Any idea? If I right click I get no save-as option. Am I an e-idiot?

**K-Man S** · #48 06-28-2007, 03:38 PM

Hey I'm practicing keeping my hands on the wheel around town and there are times that the turn is more than 180 degrees, that is troublesome to me.

What browser are you using? There should be some option to save the target as in IE, FireFox and others.

**JackWood** · #49 06-28-2007, 03:51 PM

Mmmm, Firefox. I'll try in IE.
Thanks
Jack

Gator Bite · #50 06-28-2007, 03:56 PM

I think you might have been able to overtake the Viper if you chanted "I will get you nemesis....! Yes nemesis..... You like it like that, don't you nemsis....?"

Just a thought......

(for those that don't understand the 'Nemesis' chanting, see this thread)

Money Man · #51 06-28-2007, 04:46 PM

Originally Posted by Craig@Rennstore.com

Wow, that had to be the highest quality video I have ever seen. Nice.

Drove in a Viper on track while instructing a few years ago, man are they an ungratifying machine.
Sounds like a UPS truck, feels huge, even in a straight line they are a bit blah.

Porsches rule for track use!

I nearly bought a Viper last year but the sound of the V10 is total **** to my ears. It sounds like it is dropping a cylinder. Too raspy. That is one car that I would never put an aftermarket exhaust on. V6's are pretty ugly when amplified also. I had an employee put side exhausts on his V6 Mustang. It sounded way bad. Like a demonically possessed Disney Land jungle boat.

**Craig@Rennstore.com** · #52 06-28-2007, 05:00 PM

Plus, it takes a LOT to make a Viper track worthy.
The brakes.............yeeuck. Amongst other things.

Cayman: Track pads, decent alignment, and GO HAVE FUN all day long witout a problem.

Money Man · #53 06-28-2007, 05:30 PM

Originally Posted by Craig@Rennstore.com

Plus, it takes a LOT to make a Viper track worthy.
The brakes.............yeeuck. Amongst other things.

Cayman: Track pads, decent alignment, and GO HAVE FUN all day long witout a problem.

I know I know but that long hood line sure looks good. I'm also really interested in the Thunder Roadsters. They look like cheap fun.

2005 GP Thunder Roadster Retail Guide

**drvreg** · #54 06-29-2007, 10:00 AM

Originally Posted by JackWood

RE the seat position, it might make it harder with the GT3 seats because of no rear tilt. I have to have my seat very up-right to still get a slight bent arm touching the top of the wheel with my palms (impossible to do 180 locked-thumb rotation without having this distance between shoulder and wheel right) and still have my legs in the right position for clutch. Felt unnatural at first, but now, like many things, is second nature and I always feel in total control.

I didn't find it difficult to get the correct position at all, Jack. Although the GT3 seats don't tilt, the steering wheel tilts and comes forward. Once I get my seat the right distance for comfortable pedal work, I set the wheel in just the right position. Pulling the wheel just an inch closer makes a big difference.

**drvreg** · #55 06-29-2007, 10:03 AM

Originally Posted by Money Man

I'm also really interested in the Thunder Roadsters. They look like cheap fun.

I much prefer the Radical - they drive circles around the Thunder Roadsters.

Radical Sportscars - Ten Years On - 1997-2007

caygirl · #56 06-29-2007, 01:38 PM

GREAT Video - made my heart rate go up. And makes me want to be out on the track right NOW! I wanted you to catch that Viper so bad. This is my first year to drive competitively so pardon the rookie question.... Should the Turbo have pointed you by sooner?

My harness bar has a camera mount as well so I'll shoot a video sometime. We have some awesome tracks down here. The 1.3 at MotorSport Ranch has great elevation changes and some blind corners so it'll be cool to see how that shows up on video.

**JackWood** · #57 06-29-2007, 02:06 PM

Originally Posted by drvreg

I didn't find it difficult to get the correct position at all, Jack. Although the GT3 seats don't tilt, the steering wheel tilts and comes forward. Once I get my seat the right distance for comfortable pedal work, I set the wheel in just the right position. Pulling the wheel just an inch closer makes a big difference.

Is the GT3 seat quite an upright position then? Obviously everyones body proportions are different, but always have had the wheel on maximum extension. The position is great now, just a little more upright than usual (compared to BMW for example).

Jack

**K-Man S** · #58 10-02-2007, 10:12 PM

Just an FYI I don't think I ever reported in this thread that the cause of the check engine light was the disintegrated and lodge cat material from the Milltek header/cat combo. You can see it in the Capristo install article as it was removed. As an FYI I also showed this video recently to a top Porsche driver and his comments on the shuffling as that some of it was Ok some of it was not, he pointed out where I shouldn't do it and hopefully I've corrected that now as well as understand when it is OK to do and how much. I need much more work on my footwork anyway, perhaps wearing house slippers isn't the best approach?