I have a '15 981 S I plan to start tracking soon. I may start out on stock wheels and tires (I have 20s) but ultimately will want a more track-focused tire.
I used to race in PCA, so I'm used to race tires. But I'm done dealing with tow vehicles, trailers, etc. So I want to drive to the track on the same tires I will drive on the track. (And in my case the trip from home to track is 200 miles.)
So, with all that being said, is there a track-worthy tire that is good enough on the street to be my only tire? Or should I get dedicated wheel/tire set for track? And if so, is there a track tire that is enough of an improvement on track to warrant having the extra set, while still being able to get me up and down the highway 200 miles?
From what I've read on other threads it sounds like the cup 2 might be a good only-tire choice while the trofeo R might be a good dedicated tire choice. But I worry about driving 2-3 days on track on them then having to get home.
Finally, if I got track wheels, what's the consensus for the best size? 18, 19 or 20?
what i did was OZ formula HLT 19s and MPSS they are not as sticky as the MPC2 but more durable($3700 tire rack). I also have run R comps on other cars and decided to go for less grip for ware. carl
19" and thats the only size the cup 2 comes in right now. you can go 18' and have the hoosiers. Carl am cheaper hehehehhe.. the cup 2 are not that thick if you see them.. the dept are not like your normal tire. they are good for 3k miles at the most..
This is a common dillema and one that I have pondered over many times.
The Cup2 is possibly the best 'all-rounder' as you have said.
A dedicated track tyre such as 888's, etc are ok for getting to and from the track so long as you don't encounter heavy rain/standing water when they become very unpredictable. They are also quite noisy. The increased grip though can be worth the downsides particularly if you live somewhere where it doesn't rain much.
If you decide to get a set of track wheels my money would be on 18's.
If you're a regular at the track and you drive even a little aggressively, then I think dedicated track wheels and tires pay off in the longer term. No matter what tires you use they will get trashed on the track and your wheels will get dusty and baked with OPR. For me it's nice to have a dedicated set that I can drive to- and run on- track without worrying about the wear and tear. I currently run 18's with Nitto NT-01s and I'm happy with that set-up. I may try to Pirelli Trofeo R's next.
+1 on the above, 18" Nitto 01's. Having a dedicated set of track wheels, makes it easier to check the brake pads, rotors, bleed the brakes, and wash the wheels during swapping from street to track wheels, and vice versa.
I decided to spare my 20's and get a set of track wheels and tires that I could drive to the track on- end result is OZ allggerita's and MPPS. First track coming up March 13 at VIR! Can't wait!!!!!
I always like getting dedicated track wheels/tires, then you don't have to compromise, you can get good street tires and good track tires.
I went with 19" to get better tire choice, we also autocross and the rules we run under specify 200TW or greater so that's what I go with. There are some very good street tires in 200TW which also work well on track. My personal favorites were Dunlop ZII last year (to be superseded by ZII star specs this year). Bridgestone RE-11 also make good track tires (not the RE-11A). Some people swear by Hankook RS-3v2.
Someone mentioned R888 as a track only tire, I tried them and found them not much different from the ZII (though not on the Porsche). My lap times were only fractions of a second better and they're noisy as hell. (As in oh god whats wrong, are my wheels falling off or are the legion of the damned coming for me.)
The Cup 2 tires sounded like a very good option for street/autocross with the local PCA until specifically nobbled by a rule change.
The OEM tires (we have PZeros) work pretty well on track, but I get the impression they're several seconds a lap slower than the ZII, but have not done a proper comparison.
We went with some custom wheels from CCW as the OZ ones you can get from TireRack don't have the right offset for the rules we run under.
At BMW DE years ago, the instructor group went out on a crisp, Saturday morning. We were usually the first out, so as to allow reconnaissance of the track for the students. Coming up out of turn 3, an M5's left rear wheel came off. You can imagine that there were no other incidents like that for the rest of the weekend.
I use the same wheels with RE-11 tires for track duty. Tires are a good compromise for track and limited street use. Not the very best (good just not best) handling or quickest lap time for DOT compliant tires but wear well and are fairly quiet.
+1+1+1
i also use the Nitto NT-01 and CCW C-10 18 forged wheels. I drove 300 miles to Roebling Road HPDE in the fall on new Nittos but the noise in the way home gave me a splitting headache. After a few dozen autocrosses and an AX school, the tires were at 4/32". Knowing the tires are now slicks, I decided to use a U-Haul trailer and towed my car to Roebling. I finally killed them at the HPDE this past weekend. After looking at all the choices for replacement, it came down to the Pireli Trofeor R and the Nitto NT-01. I just purchased the Nitto again because the quick wear on the Trofeo R would be too costly for the extra performance gained. I'm not racing, I'm having fun with my car and I can do ore events with the Nittos.
i used to love toyo RA1s they were great on my old lotus. You could take them down to the cord and they never heat cycled out. Wish the came in the cayman sizes. carl
see my signature... I run 18" NT01... They are sticky and great for the track. Unfortunately... they don't last too long. I get maybe 4-5 track days per set.
I live in California.... It doesn't rain in california... NOT. I don't make it a habit of running in the rain so I don't know what its like driving on NT01 in the rain!
I am also very happy with NT01's on the track. 245/275/40/18 set up.
Good grip, very predictable, good wear, handle the heat well.
I drive them to/from the track. I have not driven them in the rain.
I use only Michelins on the street. Nothing else compares for me.
Using this tire selection for the past several years with great success.
I use NT01 on my Cayman S. They are great dry weather track tires. It's 40 miles from my house to Laguna Seca and I can put up with the extra road noise. Mine are completely shot and I need to buy another set. Who has the best prices? I see that Discount Tire has really good prices. Can anyone else do better?
can any one tell me the benefits or pros and cons of using these two different tire sizes.. My Cayman S has 235/ 35-19 Front & 265/35-19
I've seen some Caymans' with a taller 235/40-19 front and 265/40-19 tire. TIA
Stock for the 981 is 235/40/19 & 265/40/19. same dia as the 235/35/20 & 265/35/20s The 235/35/19s & 265/35/19s are approx 1" smaller in dia 27.4" vs 26.3"(rear) .This in effect gives you a lower gear ratio and theoretically faster acceleration and a lower ultimate top speed. carl
Hi, new to the forum
I also find that 20"is unnecessarily big (& heavy) and am looking at lighter 19"wheels with SportCup2s for road & track days
(even if I agree it's amazing the comfort with 35 section rubber..)
anyway don't see that many options for light wheels..
several use OZ Allegerita HLT, but OZ Ultraleggera HLT seem lighter, any users of those ?
I also like the look of the forged ATS Sprintlights anybody use them ?
also had a look at CCW that btwyx mentioned, looked great, but not really feasible from the other side of the atlantic !
The "best track tire" really depends on your experience, goals, and car setup. With stock suspension I simply would stick with 200tw tires approved for track duty like the ones Lemons race cars run. Good grip, comparably long life, some are suitable for rain days. 18" offers the widest tire choice and the lowest cost.
My choices this year for DE and TT competition:
RS-3 drive to the track and hot weather practice tire.
RE-11 My all around El Nino rain tire that works well in moderate temps on a dry track.
Toyo R1 for Time Trial competition (R-Comp requires 2-3 degrees negative camber) Only run 2 sessions per weekend due to short lifespan.
3 sets of wheels, all in 18" with a tire to suit every occasion. I am ready
I am so glad I found this thread. I posted in wheel and tire section and no one could answer my question. I have a 2016 CGTS which comes with 20". Can I run 18" and not have caliper clearance issues and also not have ground clearance issues? These will be dedicated track tires and I will likely go with NT01s. Really appreciate your input on this!
Check the answer I left last night on your other thread. You will have no issues with caliper clearance with the proper offset or ground clearance problems.
I'm looking at OZ Alleggeritas 18s for wheels, seems like that is the choice of many...but a question on tire choice. My local track "pit crew" is recommending BFG R1s (over the Nittos and Michelins) given my goals of progressing into higher HPDE classes, wanting to get 6-8, maybe 10 track days out of the set, and the VERY high temperatures we face at Utahs MMSP track (yes that's the old name...)
I used the First Generation R1s on my M3 a lot. They gave decent life if they were heat cycled a week before first use. If you don't shave them, drive easy on them for a bit or you can chunk them. They had (maybe still have) a very very stiff outer sidewall. They worked best about about 35psi max hot. That means you start out on them at 25 or 26 and must be very careful with them until they get heat. They felt completely wierd steering-wise, but do they ever stick! Especially when most of what little tread they have is gone.
Camber really helps extend the life of all tires at the track, especially in front. I have 2.5 in front and 2.2 in back on my CS (for the steet). 3 might be better in front for tire wear on track days, but I don't change settings at the track. (I don't trailer).
If you put that much camber on, you have to make sure toe is near zero or you'll wear out the insides of the tires FAST on an interstate. 1/32 toe OUT in front and 2/32 toe-IN at the back works well for me. I have it done on a Hunter alignment rack. I drive on the street with those settings and wear is OK.
:cheers:
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