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My 2008 Cayman S needs some new tires soon, I'm currently running 235/35/19 and 275/35/19 Michelin Pilot Sports. I like the tire and the ride comfort, but they are summer performance tires. I live in Westchester, NY, and we have usually 4+ month below 40 temperatures, so I was wondering if I should switch to All Season tires when replacing the current ones. I'm not planning to drive in snow, or in rain, I'm just concerned about the handling of the summer tires in frigid temperatures. I had Continental DWS on my 968, I liked them and they worked great year round. They are available in the sizes I need, does anyone have any experience with them on the Cayman on 19" wheels?
 

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I have the continental DWS in 18" on a 09. I felt that the summer rubber was too sticky for my regular street driving and wanted something that would slide more without going at silly speeds on the street. In regular driving I am finding the DWS to be very good, can get the car to move sideways more and they work for me. I like that I still have traction on those 35 degree rainy days which I don't find to be the case on pure summer rubber. Bottom line - I would buy them again.
 

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Maybe that's a very European view, but all season tires in Europe are only used for boring hatchbacks and sedans by people who would not intentionally drive when it's freezing or snowing but want to be prepared. Doubt you would get all-season tires in Porsche dimensions over here in Europe. Proper summer tires in summer and switch two winter tires (not for snow only, they are also doing fine at cold temperatures and in the wet) for the winter season.

My 2 cents
Sven
 

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I hate all season tires, they just plain suck at everything.

if you are not going to go out in snow, I recommend the Extreme DW, not DWS. I am on my second set on my Subaru. I live in area that does get cold but rarely gets snow but I have also lived in upstate NY and driven in the snow all winter long. The Conti DW in particular in my experience retains traction into colder temps better than other summer tires I have tried, Bridgestone 050 and Michelin PSS. The cold traction of the 050 really was bad but with the DW, it was nearly imperceptible for me. additionally, I have been caught out in 5-8 inches of snow with the DW, a summer tire, and was able to drive better than others around me (Subaru, not Porsche) very impressed.

I might be moving to the DW myself when my PSS wear out. That is when I plan to have separate tires for track and autocross so even through the grip will not be as good as the PSS, the cost is much lower and I just don't need it on the street.

One quirk I experienced with the DW is that traction does suffer more significantly as the tread gets near the wear bars. I used to run tires to near slicks often but not with the DW.
 

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Can you describe your driving plans a bit more? Will it be taking your DE out for an hr of excercise on a sunny, no snow on the roads type day? Or would it be I'm going to drive it to work or on a night out because the forecast is good? Two entirely different scenarios. If your plan is to take it out in the 1st scenario, summer tires will work as long as you're being cautious - the idea is to drive, not set new records on the offramp. If your plan is #2, I would recommend getting snow tires. I'm sure your weather people are just as bad as they are here in the heartland. You get up in the morning and they say it's going to be a nice day so you drive your Cayman to work. At 10am you look out the window and it's snowing to beat the band. Oh oh (or worse words). You don't want to get caught out in those situations. And they happen, even when you had no intention. You definitely don't want to have summer tires on in that situation.

All season tires by their nature are compromises. They don't do anything well, they do several things adequately.

Before I got into Porsches, I had an 01 MR2 Spyder. It came with Yoko gumball qualifying tires that were worthless in the snow. I bought a set of Firestone A/S tires and they worked great. They were a 55 series tire. My 1st Porsche was a 4 yr old 01 Boxster S that I bought in the summer. The tires needed replacing before winter so I thought I'd go the A/S route again. Bought a set of Kumhos. They were terrible. Worthless in snow or ice. After chancing a few storms to get in and out of work, I ended up hitching a ride with my hot neighbor who also worked at the same place. Next winter I bought some Blizzaks and everything was fine. I still have those Blizzaks - they're currently on my CSS.

Maybe the Kumhos were crap A/S tires. Maybe the A/S technology has improved in 9 yrs. But an A/S tire is still a compromise. Esp with a size tire a Porsche requires. An A/S tire has to be balanced to be good in the winter and summer. With a 35 or 40 series tire, which do you think the tire companies will lean towards? Has to be summer. You've got a car that might need to take that A/S tire up to 150mph. So can it be a Jack Of All Trades and be effective at 10* and 4" of snow? Probably not. I think the A/S tires on my MR2 worked because they were a 55 series tire not intended to go high speeds.

As far as summer tires working in cold temps, I recently did a Fast Fri at my local road course when the temp was barely 45*. It was a bit slick but I never even kicked PSM in. Summer tires don't turn into shiny rocks and you loose all traction in cold temps. I'm currently running Pilot SSs.

A lot to chew on, I know. But you don't want to spend $1000 and find out you've wasted your money.
 

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OP - opinions are like bellybuttons, everybody has one.

I'd say I am out voted and you should buy an extra set of wheels and tires w/ snows and have summer rubber mounted your 19s. I am sticking with the no seasons that are adequate for me in the slop and will slide a bit in the dry. I am of the school that the Caymans do the job too well on city streets and I am looking for a little less traction :)
 

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I have the continental DWS in 18" on a 09. I felt that the summer rubber was too sticky for my regular street driving and wanted something that would slide more without going at silly speeds on the street. In regular driving I am finding the DWS to be very good, can get the car to move sideways more and they work for me. I like that I still have traction on those 35 degree rainy days which I don't find to be the case on pure summer rubber. Bottom line - I would buy them again.
As a fellow Buckeye, I'm thinking about the same thing.

The PZeros that came stock on the 981 are about half worn in the rear, so I'm looking at replacements. I hate to spring for a complete new set if the fronts are ok but the P Zeros aren't my favorite tire and the rears are roughly $400/each.

I have a set of Nitto NT01s for the track and think a less performance oriented street tire makes more sense when not on the track; I'd like a quieter tire as well as the ability to use the car more in April or November when temps get below 40deg. with regularity but there isn't much snow.

I'm thinking about an A/S but there are none in stock sizes; I may have to go up to a +1 size--245/275-40/19 to find one that fits. I have the DWS on a BMW and they are fine except the steering response is a bit tardy with the soft sidewall.

Right now I'm looking as the Mich. PS A/S3 or the the GY Asym F1 A/S; both get pretty good reviews with the Mich. a bit more performance oriented, but the GY is way less expensive.
 

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I have the Conti's DWS on 19s. 235/35 ZR 19 front and 275/35 ZR 19 rear. I have been driving them here in Iowa with temps below 15. They perform great. I am not currently planning on doing DEs with these tires. When I do, I am planning on getting a set of lightweight 18' and top end tires. For the driving that I do, the DWS perform the way I expect them to. I have even had the car up to 120 with these tires and the car was very stable. If you want all seasons, these are the ones to get.

ImageUploadedByTapatalk1418084696.553508.jpg
 

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As a fellow Buckeye, I'm thinking about the same thing.

The PZeros that came stock on the 981 are about half worn in the rear, so I'm looking at replacements. I hate to spring for a complete new set if the fronts are ok but the P Zeros aren't my favorite tire and the rears are roughly $400/each.

I have a set of Nitto NT01s for the track and think a less performance oriented street tire makes more sense when not on the track; I'd like a quieter tire as well as the ability to use the car more in April or November when temps get below 40deg. with regularity but there isn't much snow.

I'm thinking about an A/S but there are none in stock sizes; I may have to go up to a +1 size--245/275-40/19 to find one that fits. I have the DWS on a BMW and they are fine except the steering response is a bit tardy with the soft sidewall.

Right now I'm looking as the Mich. PS A/S3 or the the GY Asym F1 A/S; both get pretty good reviews with the Mich. a bit more performance oriented, but the GY is way less expensive.
Mike and OP:

I have real Pirelli Sottozeros on my CS. I'm on my 2nd used set and I really like them. They're not so snow oriented that you're bored to death. They handle great and stick better than summers on cold, dry pavement. i put them on used 18" Boxster S wheels. Car looks decent with them.

I think people on the cusp of the snow belt, where they get a snow or two but temps also get up to 75 degrees on some days, could do with good A/S instead of Winters. Winters are great but they wear pretty quickly in hot weather.

In the snow belt, if you're only taking the car out for a little exercise now and then in the winter, you can get away with A/S. Summer tires really don't make me happy in cold weather. They just don't stick, even on dry pavement. In the snow, most of them are pathetic. At temps at or below zero F, they're dangerous because they don't stick and because hitting a pothole can break the belts and/or crack the casings pretty easily. Also, I doubt you'd have much luck mending a broken casing with that bottle of tire goo.

In summer, A/S are not necessarily boring. If you're commuting and just having a little fun with the car and don't care about lap times or ultimate grip, they can be OK. Some are better than others. On a car like the Cayman, spend some money and get good ones.

I've had the top performance Conti A/S on a previous Audi A6. Those tires stick very well in the snow and work in deluge rain too. They are nice tires, but the split tread is troubling to me. The Audi had a little bit of strangeness going on with the steering. Handling was good once you committed to a corner, but the transition between straight ahead driving and turning in was a little awkward. Good tires, with a small issue...for me.

Then I got a new used A6. It came with Eagle F1 summer tires on 19" wheels. Audi wanted a lot of money for winter tires, so I got a set of the Michelin PS A/S 3 that Mike is considering. They're a great tire in summer and didn't lose much to the F1s but last year, they didn't stick as well as I'd hoped....and they were brand new. I'm starting what's looking like a pretty brutal winter season with this set. If I find myself slipping around too much, I'll buy something else.

So, I wouldn't probably buy the Contis for a CS. I think that tread might be an even bigger problem with wider tires (I had 245s). If they're going to be winter only tires, maybe.

I would buy the Michelin PS A/S 3 IF I were only going out now and then OR if I lived on the South of the snow belt. I'd draw this line about Mason/Dixon or a little further down than that....depends on the terrain. They probably won't get you through the deep stuff without help from a neighbor kid. I think I'll get through OK with my A6, but not without some extra effort.

I don't know this BFG tire at all. Sounds interesting!

:cheers:
 

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Discussion Starter #10
There is a lot of good feedback here, thank you. My intention is to drive through the winter on cold, sunny days, but not snow/ice or rain. For the summer, I'm not tracking (I'm more a fast cruiser :)) and rarely go above 120. I also don't want to have to spend money on two different sets of wheels/tires and have to change twice a year... So, I think the best choice for my personal situation are All Season tires, and I'll likely go with the Conti DWS. I had good experience with them on my 968 (on 17" wheels) and it sounds like it also works well on the CS.
 

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I hate all season tires, they just plain suck at everything.

if you are not going to go out in snow, I recommend the Extreme DW, not DWS. I am on my second set on my Subaru. I live in area that does get cold but rarely gets snow but I have also lived in upstate NY and driven in the snow all winter long. The Conti DW in particular in my experience retains traction into colder temps better than other summer tires I have tried, Bridgestone 050 and Michelin PSS. The cold traction of the 050 really was bad but with the DW, it was nearly imperceptible for me. additionally, I have been caught out in 5-8 inches of snow with the DW, a summer tire, and was able to drive better than others around me (Subaru, not Porsche) very impressed.

I might be moving to the DW myself when my PSS wear out. That is when I plan to have separate tires for track and autocross so even through the grip will not be as good as the PSS, the cost is much lower and I just don't need it on the street.

One quirk I experienced with the DW is that traction does suffer more significantly as the tread gets near the wear bars. I used to run tires to near slicks often but not with the DW.
Interesting--just what I was looking for; the summer tire that gives up some performance for less noise, a more supple ride and the ability to drive when ambient temps get close to freezing--but no snow. Exactly what I was looking for.
 

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All season tires are a compromise every day of the year:

Above 42 degrees summer tires beat all season tires in every weather condition.
Even in rain a high performance summer tire like the Michelin PSS offers way better traction, handling and performance than any all season tire on the market.

Below 42 degrees Winter tires beat all season tires in every weather condition.
 

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The 981 is a sports car. So it comes equipped with summer tires for maximum traction. Even sporty sedans like the Audi S4 come equipped with summer tires. On the other hand if the car is a DD that will be used year around, and convenience and price trump traction, then I suppose an all season radial will do.
 

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All season tires are a compromise every day of the year:

Above 42 degrees summer tires beat all season tires in every weather condition.
Even in rain a high performance summer tire like the Michelin PSS offers way better traction, handling and performance than any all season tire on the market.

Below 42 degrees Winter tires beat all season tires in every weather condition.
Speaking for myself, I don't need a winter set since driving in the snow isn't in the cards for the 981.
I've got a set of track tires for DEs, so all that I need is a set of street tires which handle street duties well enough--decent handling since I'm not driving even 8/10s on the street--along with a supple ride and quiet at highway speeds. After 2 years with the PZeros, a quiet tire that doesn't get funny in the occasional rain strong would be much appreciated.

For those above mentioned requirements--and the ability to handle temps near freezing in early spring/late fall--I think a HP A/S --like the PS A/S3 would function very well.
 

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I have GoodYear F1 Asymetric all seasons and use them all year in Toronto.
My car is not a daily driver, but if pressed, these things could saw through the little bit of snow we get easy!
I even got them 10mm more narrow to get a little more slideways in the dry! ;)

GoodYear F1.jpg
 

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I have GoodYear F1 Asymetric all seasons and use them all year in Toronto.
My car is not a daily driver, but if pressed, these things could saw through the little bit of snow we get easy!
I even got them 10mm more narrow to get a little more slideways in the dry! ;)

View attachment 53811
What were your OE tires and how do these compare?
So--you went with a 225/255-40-19 combo?
 

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I'm glad that I don't have to deal with that issue.:drivingskid:
How do your summer performance tires stand up to red hot lava?

Just mounted up my Michelin Alpin PA4 N-Spec's. Why run the risk of losing control and damaging the car, or worse, hurting yourself or someone else? Running summer tires in the winter is a false economy.
 

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I have GoodYear F1 Asymetric all seasons and use them all year in Toronto.
My car is not a daily driver, but if pressed, these things could saw through the little bit of snow we get easy!
I even got them 10mm more narrow to get a little more slideways in the dry! ;)

View attachment 53811
Alfie:

Based on their summer tire, which I like a lot, I'm inclined to like your F1 A/S solution. I still like and use winter tires here in Chicago, but if I were in, say, St. Louis or Louisville or someplace where it gets up in the 70s in winter, I might choose this tire. I think my Michelin Pilot A/S 3's are another good solution.

As I said, I'm not crazy about the Continental DSW because it's got a very divided tread that gives a non-intuitive sort of feedback sometimes. They stick great in snow and have decent limits in dry, but they're not for me because of the divided response.

In Toronto, I really would prefer winter tires.

:cheers:
 
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