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Crusin worlds most isolated city
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Local dealer reports some Boxters' and some 911s' can get MAS failure due to the increased air flow when a high flow rate filter is fitted.


I figure the sensor element wire must burn out because the increased air flow cools the heated wire more. So to compensateto get a reading of the air flow rate the control circuitmust pump for current to heat it up more and this may be the problem. However I think this may only be the case when continued high RPM is encounted. Does that sound correct? Im no expert on this. Any reports of problems yet? Maybe its too soon to tell.
 

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I think they are referring to the old 986 days when over-oiled air filters would cause oil to foul the MAS sensor, I've never heard anything about this wire heating story. I've got 1500-2000 miles on my EVO intake with no problems. We blew the air filter out with an air hose to get rid of excess oil before installation though, it was over-oiled in our opinions.
 

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Crusin worlds most isolated city
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Discussion Starter · #4 ·
Lets hope thats all it could be. Thing is with most service companies they replace parts without knowing the real reason for the problem is the first place. Guess you cant expect them to be all knowing.
 

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Almost 1000 miles on the EVO intake and the only problem is excessive speeding and excessive engine redlining just to hear the intake growl! /fckeditor/editor/images/smiley/MWPX/angel_smile.gif
 

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The issue has most always been with over oiling the filter. The oil mist would get sucked into the MAF and 'cook' on the wire essentially coating it and skewing readings, etc.



In all honesty I've never been keen on any aftermarket filter such as this. They usually cause more trouble than they are worth, let more dirt in the engine and often lose HP compared to the stock filter......especially in a Porsche......who may restrict intake in some areas, but usually not in the filter. I've gone through this 'upgrade' in just about every Porsche......and it has always ended up the same, very minimal gain (1 HP) if any, sometimes a big loss in HP (older Porsches), and much dirtier oil. Seen with my own eyes, several times.



I'm a big fan of freeing up the intake side whenever possible, but I'll definitely be keeping the stock filter in the Cayman,.... the upsides of most aftermarket filters, if any, are not worth the downsides IMO.



Anyone have any verifiable gains (dyno?) from the EVO intake anyway??
 

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gains or not its not worth the crap that gets passed the filter. Oil / cotton filters flow more air, but filter poorly. I highly suggest K&N users to have their oil tested to make sure the crap is under control....at the very least reduce the oil change intervals to be cautious.
 

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gains or not its not worth the crap that gets passed the filter. Oil / cotton filters flow more air, but filter poorly. I highly suggest K&N users to have their oil tested to make sure the crap is under control....at the very least reduce the oil change intervals to be cautious.


Hit the nail on the head. I once tried a K&N in my 928GT for 3k miles including a trip to the dyno. The results were 4 less HP compared to the stock filter (swapped them in minutes on the dyno) and oil that looked black in 3k. There were also a few driveability problems. Stock paper filter......oil looked new after 6k miles. It's only your motor!
 

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The german paper filters are quite good, Mahle etc. flow better than the US ones including Fram etc. and the usual suspects often compared to by K&Ns marketing gurus.


If your leasing the car and you get the car tuned and run a higher flow filter / intake - fine, why not. But if your Porsche is a keeper then the 2-3hp can be had elsewhere easy enough w/o the engine eating fine dirt particles!
 

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Another vote for oem paper air filters. On a prior car, I ran a K&N for about 5k miles & then found acollection of decent sized grit that had gotten past the filter & accumulated in the base of the air box. I thought about all the smaller crap that had been sucked into the engine & decided that I'd stick w/the better filtration of a paper filter for any engine I cared to preserve.


BTW, even if I leased my Cayman, I'd be just as concerned about dimished life. Not because it would effectmy ownership, but because I respect fine machinery.
 

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<p class="MsoNormal" style="MARGIN: 0in 0in 0pt">Here is K&N’s take on [/quote]filtration[/quote] test. [/quote]Found @ K&N’s FAQ link.[/quote]
<p class="MsoNormal" style="MARGIN: 0in 0in 0pt">.[/quote]
<p class="MsoNormal" style="MARGIN: 0in 0in 0pt">zornet /fckeditor/editor/images/smiley/MWPX/whatchutalkingabout_smile.gif<o:p></o:p>[/quote]
<p class="MsoNormal" style="MARGIN: 0in 0in 0pt"><o:p></o:p>[/quote]


What is the micron rating and filtering efficiency of the K&N filter?



Air filters are not rated by micron size on an absolute basis. (See technical service bulletin 89-5R from the Filter Manufacturer's Council) The proper rating system for air filters is a testing procedure developed to measure the efficiency of the filtration media at varying micron sizes. We routinely subject a sample of our air filters to this testing procedure conducted by independent laboratories. The primary purpose of this testing is to ensure that our air filter designs meet or exceed automotive industry standards. Until recently filtration tests were performed in accordance with the Society of Automotive Engineer's (SAE) J726 testing procedure, however, we now use the ISO 5011procedure which that superseded the SAE procedure. [/quote]<o:p></o:p>[/quote]


The content of the test dust used in accordance with the SAE testing procedure is as follows:[/quote]<o:p></o:p>[/quote]
<div align="center">
<table style="mso-cellspacing: .7pt" cellspacing="1" cellpadding="0" border="0">
<tbody>
<tr>
<td style="BORDER-RIGHT: #c8c8c8; PADDING-RIGHT: 0.75pt; BORDER-TOP: #c8c8c8; PADDING-LEFT: 0.75pt; PADDING-BOTTOM: 0.75pt; BORDER-LEFT: #c8c8c8; PADDING-TOP: 0.75pt; BORDER-BOTTOM: #c8c8c8; BACKGROUND-COLOR: transparent">
<p class="MsoNormal" style="MARGIN: 0in 0in 0pt; TEXT-ALIGN: center" align="center"> Particle Size in Microns[/quote]<o:p></o:p>[/quote]
</td>
<td style="BORDER-RIGHT: #c8c8c8; PADDING-RIGHT: 0.75pt; BORDER-TOP: #c8c8c8; PADDING-LEFT: 0.75pt; PADDING-BOTTOM: 0.75pt; BORDER-LEFT: #c8c8c8; PADDING-TOP: 0.75pt; BORDER-BOTTOM: #c8c8c8; BACKGROUND-COLOR: transparent">
<p class="MsoNormal" style="MARGIN: 0in 0in 0pt; TEXT-ALIGN: center" align="center"> % by Volume (+/- 3%)[/quote]<o:p></o:p>[/quote]
</td>
</tr>
<tr>
<td style="BORDER-RIGHT: #c8c8c8; PADDING-RIGHT: 0.75pt; BORDER-TOP: #c8c8c8; PADDING-LEFT: 0.75pt; PADDING-BOTTOM: 0.75pt; BORDER-LEFT: #c8c8c8; PADDING-TOP: 0.75pt; BORDER-BOTTOM: #c8c8c8; BACKGROUND-COLOR: transparent">
<p class="MsoNormal" style="MARGIN: 0in 0in 0pt; TEXT-ALIGN: center" align="center"><5.5[/quote]<o:p></o:p>[/quote]
</td>
<td style="BORDER-RIGHT: #c8c8c8; PADDING-RIGHT: 0.75pt; BORDER-TOP: #c8c8c8; PADDING-LEFT: 0.75pt; PADDING-BOTTOM: 0.75pt; BORDER-LEFT: #c8c8c8; PADDING-TOP: 0.75pt; BORDER-BOTTOM: #c8c8c8; BACKGROUND-COLOR: transparent">
<p class="MsoNormal" style="MARGIN: 0in 0in 0pt; TEXT-ALIGN: center" align="center">13[/quote]<o:p></o:p>[/quote]
</td>
</tr>
<tr>
<td style="BORDER-RIGHT: #c8c8c8; PADDING-RIGHT: 0.75pt; BORDER-TOP: #c8c8c8; PADDING-LEFT: 0.75pt; PADDING-BOTTOM: 0.75pt; BORDER-LEFT: #c8c8c8; PADDING-TOP: 0.75pt; BORDER-BOTTOM: #c8c8c8; BACKGROUND-COLOR: transparent">
<p class="MsoNormal" style="MARGIN: 0in 0in 0pt; TEXT-ALIGN: center" align="center">5.5 to 11[/quote]<o:p></o:p>[/quote]
</td>
<td style="BORDER-RIGHT: #c8c8c8; PADDING-RIGHT: 0.75pt; BORDER-TOP: #c8c8c8; PADDING-LEFT: 0.75pt; PADDING-BOTTOM: 0.75pt; BORDER-LEFT: #c8c8c8; PADDING-TOP: 0.75pt; BORDER-BOTTOM: #c8c8c8; BACKGROUND-COLOR: transparent">
<p class="MsoNormal" style="MARGIN: 0in 0in 0pt; TEXT-ALIGN: center" align="center">11[/quote]<o:p></o:p>[/quote]
</td>
</tr>
<tr>
<td style="BORDER-RIGHT: #c8c8c8; PADDING-RIGHT: 0.75pt; BORDER-TOP: #c8c8c8; PADDING-LEFT: 0.75pt; PADDING-BOTTOM: 0.75pt; BORDER-LEFT: #c8c8c8; PADDING-TOP: 0.75pt; BORDER-BOTTOM: #c8c8c8; BACKGROUND-COLOR: transparent">
<p class="MsoNormal" style="MARGIN: 0in 0in 0pt; TEXT-ALIGN: center" align="center">11 to 22[/quote]<o:p></o:p>[/quote]
</td>
<td style="BORDER-RIGHT: #c8c8c8; PADDING-RIGHT: 0.75pt; BORDER-TOP: #c8c8c8; PADDING-LEFT: 0.75pt; PADDING-BOTTOM: 0.75pt; BORDER-LEFT: #c8c8c8; PADDING-TOP: 0.75pt; BORDER-BOTTOM: #c8c8c8; BACKGROUND-COLOR: transparent">
<p class="MsoNormal" style="MARGIN: 0in 0in 0pt; TEXT-ALIGN: center" align="center">13[/quote]<o:p></o:p>[/quote]
</td>
</tr>
<tr>
<td style="BORDER-RIGHT: #c8c8c8; PADDING-RIGHT: 0.75pt; BORDER-TOP: #c8c8c8; PADDING-LEFT: 0.75pt; PADDING-BOTTOM: 0.75pt; BORDER-LEFT: #c8c8c8; PADDING-TOP: 0.75pt; BORDER-BOTTOM: #c8c8c8; BACKGROUND-COLOR: transparent">
<p class="MsoNormal" style="MARGIN: 0in 0in 0pt; TEXT-ALIGN: center" align="center">22 to 44[/quote]<o:p></o:p>[/quote]
</td>
<td style="BORDER-RIGHT: #c8c8c8; PADDING-RIGHT: 0.75pt; BORDER-TOP: #c8c8c8; PADDING-LEFT: 0.75pt; PADDING-BOTTOM: 0.75pt; BORDER-LEFT: #c8c8c8; PADDING-TOP: 0.75pt; BORDER-BOTTOM: #c8c8c8; BACKGROUND-COLOR: transparent">
<p class="MsoNormal" style="MARGIN: 0in 0in 0pt; TEXT-ALIGN: center" align="center">19[/quote]<o:p></o:p>[/quote]
</td>
</tr>
<tr>
<td style="BORDER-RIGHT: #c8c8c8; PADDING-RIGHT: 0.75pt; BORDER-TOP: #c8c8c8; PADDING-LEFT: 0.75pt; PADDING-BOTTOM: 0.75pt; BORDER-LEFT: #c8c8c8; PADDING-TOP: 0.75pt; BORDER-BOTTOM: #c8c8c8; BACKGROUND-COLOR: transparent">
<p class="MsoNormal" style="MARGIN: 0in 0in 0pt; TEXT-ALIGN: center" align="center">44 to 88[/quote]<o:p></o:p>[/quote]
</td>
<td style="BORDER-RIGHT: #c8c8c8; PADDING-RIGHT: 0.75pt; BORDER-TOP: #c8c8c8; PADDING-LEFT: 0.75pt; PADDING-BOTTOM: 0.75pt; BORDER-LEFT: #c8c8c8; PADDING-TOP: 0.75pt; BORDER-BOTTOM: #c8c8c8; BACKGROUND-COLOR: transparent">
<p class="MsoNormal" style="MARGIN: 0in 0in 0pt; TEXT-ALIGN: center" align="center">28[/quote]<o:p></o:p>[/quote]
</td>
</tr>
<tr>
<td style="BORDER-RIGHT: #c8c8c8; PADDING-RIGHT: 0.75pt; BORDER-TOP: #c8c8c8; PADDING-LEFT: 0.75pt; PADDING-BOTTOM: 0.75pt; BORDER-LEFT: #c8c8c8; PADDING-TOP: 0.75pt; BORDER-BOTTOM: #c8c8c8; BACKGROUND-COLOR: transparent">
<p class="MsoNormal" style="MARGIN: 0in 0in 0pt; TEXT-ALIGN: center" align="center">88 to 176[/quote]<o:p></o:p>[/quote]
</td>
<td style="BORDER-RIGHT: #c8c8c8; PADDING-RIGHT: 0.75pt; BORDER-TOP: #c8c8c8; PADDING-LEFT: 0.75pt; PADDING-BOTTOM: 0.75pt; BORDER-LEFT: #c8c8c8; PADDING-TOP: 0.75pt; BORDER-BOTTOM: #c8c8c8; BACKGROUND-COLOR: transparent">
<p class="MsoNormal" style="MARGIN: 0in 0in 0pt; TEXT-ALIGN: center" align="center">16[/quote]<o:p></o:p>[/quote]
</td>
</tr>
</tbody>
</table>
</div>
 

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1,685 Posts
<p class="MsoNormal" style="MARGIN: 0in 0in 0pt">And K&N’s take [/quote]mass air sensor to failure[/quote]. [/quote]Found @ K&N’s FAQ link.[/quote]
<p class="MsoNormal" style="MARGIN: 0in 0in 0pt">.[/quote]
<p class="MsoNormal" style="MARGIN: 0in 0in 0pt">zornet /fckeditor/editor/images/smiley/MWPX/whatchutalkingabout_smile.gif<o:p></o:p>[/quote]
<p class="MsoNormal" style="MARGIN: 0in 0in 0pt">.<o:p></o:p>[/quote]
Will a K&N filter cause my vehicle’s mass air sensor to fail?[/quote]



At this time, K&N is unaware of any evidence that K&N air filter oil from a K&N air filter can damage or cause the malfunction of a MAF sensor, regardless of the make of the vehicle involved. K&N takes seriously any claim that one of its products is incompatible with its designated application or can damage or cause the malfunction of any automotive component. Such claims are thoroughly investigated and, when appropriate, testing is undertaken to determine their merit. In the case of MAF sensors, ongoing tests have shown that contamination from K&N air filter oil has not caused any failures or malfunctions of the MAF sensors in the test vehicles. K&N is aware that MAF sensors can become contaminated for a variety of reasons, unrelated to a K&N air filter (such as backfiring, blowby, leaking airbox or leaking intake duct) and that various methods have been used by some service departments and repair shops to clean a dirty or contaminated MAF sensor, such as spraying with an appropriate cleaner. K&N has not completed any tests as to the efficacy of such a process and, therefore, does not officially endorse or recommend any cleaning process. However, if given the choice of either replacing a MAF sensor or cleaning it, K&N recommends that the consumer ask his or her automotive dealer to attempt cleaning, before replacement. It should be noted that the presence of contamination does not mean the contamination was the cause of the MAF sensor failure. Sensors can fail for electrical or mechanical reasons, unrelated to any visible contamination.[/quote] [/quote]
 
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