[SSearchVT]

It snowed again this weekend in Vermont, so I opted to ignore mother nature and hide in my garage. I bought my 2006 Cayman S last fall and according to the records it was due for a brake fluid flush (2+ years had passed). I've done this for the last 30+ years with a buddy doing the - push it down, hold it, let it up, I owe you some beer. It's been a long winter and to stay sane I've been buying tools - I picked up a Motive Power Bleeder with the Porsche adapter for about $40 from Amazon...

This makes a fluid change or bleeding a brake system goat stupid! And takes out the buddy that you need to buy beer for afterwards.

Putting the adapter on - use teflon tape on the pipe threads - yes, it's brake fluid, but it seals any potential leaks, and only has to last an hour. Take it off when you're cleaning your tools.

From experience - I put the car on it's battery tender (through the cigarette lighter in the console). Put 2 liters of fluid in the jug. I took my battery cover off, put a shop rag on top of the battery and used that as a flat surface for the power bleeder to sit on. Take the cap off the master cylinder, pre-twist the hose for the bleeder a turn or two, and snug it down on the master cylinder. Pump it up to about 15 psi.

I started passenger rear (the wheel farthest from the master cylinder) - Jack the wheel off the ground, take the tire off. I opted to leave it on the jack - I wasn't under the car, and wasn't going to be there long. Use jackstands or other supports as you see fit... The bleeders are 11mm, the adapter comes with a piece of clear hose the right size, and I opted to measure the volume of fluid by feeding into a graduated cylinder (ratio rite). I started with the inner bleeder and took out 250 cc (fluid looked better at about this point), pumped the bleeder back up to 15 psi, switched to the outer bleeder and took another 50 cc. I had a bucket of soapy water and a brush ready and cleaned the caliper at this point. Put the wheel back on, switch to the drivers rear - repeat. The front calipers are closer, but larger - I kept an eye on the drain hose to see when new fluid was coming through, the volume was about the same as the rears...

Keep an eye on the level in the power bleeder - 2 liters of new fluid is enough, but for the last bit of the fronts it could get a little low. When I saw the new fluid come through the drain hose I stopped, and emptied the waste. The extra fluid I cycled through was poured back into the power bleeder for security (slowly loosen the top pump to release the pressure)... I ended up with about 1 liter of unused fluid.

Siphon the extra fluid out of the master cylinder to get it back down to below the MAX level. Put the covers back on, clean up your tools - you're done. Another lesson from experience - after doing brake work or handling chemicals - wash the entire car. It's a lot easier than trying to remember where you might have touched... I hope this helps!

 

[buffalosoldier]

Great write up!

Did you consider the “dry” method? (Keeping the Motive reservoir empty and just using it as a pressure source to force the fluid through the master cylinder, stopping and adding fluid as-needed).

I have my new Motive and fluid...haven’t done it yet and was wondering which way was better/easier.

 

[SSearchVT]

Great write up!

Did you consider the “dry” method? (Keeping the Motive reservoir empty and just using it as a pressure source to force the fluid through the master cylinder, stopping and adding fluid as-needed).

I have my new Motive and fluid...haven’t done it yet and was wondering which way was better/easier.

I looked at this - But decided it was more running around because I would have had to keep refilling the master cylinder... Filling the jug - I did it basically once and cleaned it up when I was done...

 

[Rob VN]

I remove as much old brake fluid from the master cylinder before starting the flush process. I use the dry method. Did you flush your clutch if so equipped?

 

[SSearchVT]

I remove as much old brake fluid from the master cylinder before starting the flush process. I use the dry method. Did you flush your clutch if so equipped?

I didn't do the clutch - In my opinion the fluid doesn't see the operating conditions the brake fluid does (heat/cool/attract water), on a street driven car - If it isn't leaking or causing problems I leave it alone...

As for removing the fluid from the master cylinder - That does keep you from cycling additional fluid through the system, If it's grubby old fluid I do this so I can see if there's crud in the reservoir. Looking at the existing fluid and my service records I opted to leave it. With 2 liters loaded into the power bleeder it was a toss up between the time to pull the old fluid out and just waiting for the new fluid to show up in the drain hose.

Additionally - One of the smartest things I did when setting up my garage was to put a TV on the wall ($150 flat screen - the cheapest TV Best Buy had, and it came with the mount!)- While I was sitting there doing the brain dead activity of watching a cylinder fill I also had a movie going...

 

[zuch]

I used the Motive bleeder and the dry method. You can flush between 300-400 ml before you need to depressurize and refill the master cylinder. It was easier for me to just remember do that after each bleeder valve, so basically 8 fill up and pressurize cycles. If flush too much, the first thing to get air is the clutch line. That clutch bleeder is not fun to get to and it also seems to flow much faster than the brake bleed nipples.

 

[RSchwerer]

I've always used the dry method. I cut the Motive hose and added a small brass valve so I don't have to depressurize the Motive tank to add more brake fluid to the reservoir.

 

[zuch]

Does your small valve allow you to depressurize the master cylinder or does it just isolate the pressure between the tank and the master cylinder so the tank pressure isn't lost?

 

[racergreg]

Another vote for the dry method. I did a mod similar to RSchwerer, put a dry break fitting in the motive hose.

 

[olegd]

Very informative thread!

I got this bleeder from ECS Tuning, but haven't used it yet. In fact, I've never done brake bleeding myself. I plan to do it before my next track event at the end of this month.

I guess its all I need for a "dry" method?

Available here if anyone is interested:
https://www.ecstuning.com/b-schwaben-parts/compact-european-pressure-brake-bleeder/018222sch01a/

 

[Zach L]

Very informative thread!

I got this bleeder from ECS Tuning, but haven't used it yet. In fact, I've never done brake bleeding myself. I plan to do it before my next track event at the end of this month.

I guess its all I need for a "dry" method?

View attachment 190265

Available here if anyone is interested:
https://www.ecstuning.com/b-schwaben-parts/compact-european-pressure-brake-bleeder/018222sch01a/

I'm a 10+ year customer of ECS, but would recommend never buying Schwaben tools.

Schwaben is ECS's in house tool brand. Pretty much everything is rebranded Chinese stuff that can be bought for WAY cheaper elsewhere. Their floor jacks for instance are the same jacks sourced from the same manufacturer as Harbor Freight jacks, just different colors. Same is true for their other tools which can often be bought on Amazon for 1/3 the price. They don't engineer or make anything themselves.

Not saying the tools are bad - I use Harbor Freight floor jacks - just saying buying from them is paying way too much.

 

[olegd]

I've used a couple Schwaben tools: oil filter socket and a compact socket set - they have served me well so far, and they seem to be well made. I noticed that Pelican Parts is now carrying Schwaben as well. Maybe they are not that bad for backyard mechanics like me Sometimes its hard to find a tool for a specific job, like that oil filter socket for example. It only cost me $10!

 

[STLPCA]

Does your small valve allow you to depressurize the master cylinder or does it just isolate the pressure between the tank and the master cylinder so the tank pressure isn't lost?

Installing an in-line valve allows you to release the MC pressure (when using the Motive dry method) to refill it without having to pump up the Motive again. Makes the process easier and faster. BTW, getting the Motive "Black Label" is well worthwhile for its aluminum MC cap with swiveling pressure tube fitting which prevents hose kinking.

My plastic valve was a few bucks at Home Depot and is going on 8 years:

 

[newold_m]

I'm a 10+ year customer of ECS, but would recommend never buying Schwaben tools.

Schwaben is ECS's in house tool brand. Pretty much everything is rebranded Chinese stuff that can be bought for WAY cheaper elsewhere. Their floor jacks for instance are the same jacks sourced from the same manufacturer as Harbor Freight jacks, just different colors. Same is true for their other tools which can often be bought on Amazon for 1/3 the price. They don't engineer or make anything themselves.

Not saying the tools are bad - I use Harbor Freight floor jacks - just saying buying from them is paying way too much.

Another thumbs down for the Schwann bleeder kit. Mine would not hold vacuum and was leading out of the box. Returned it back to ECS and will get a Motive instead.

 

[zuch]

Ok, so you are using a simple 2-way valve and you release the pressure from the MC by loosening the MC cap? I was always scared to do this thinking brake fluid would go spraying everywhere

 

[RSchwerer]

Ok, so you are using a simple 2-way valve and you release the pressure from the MC by loosening the MC cap? I was always scared to do this thinking brake fluid would go spraying everywhere

Not with the dry method, and when you slowly turn the cap just enough to release pressure. Also, the reason you're removing the cap is because the fluid is getting low, so the chance of spraying fluid is even less. I've never had an issue.
Come to think of it, don't you do something similar with the wet method? You open the motive bleeder cap to release pressure.

 

[buffalosoldier]

Great info here! Dry method it is.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

 

[superhighperf]

i have had good luck using the dry method and a quick release compressor hose fitting to keep pressure in the bottle. i also have an air tank set up so i can pressurize the bottle using my compressor.
if you have an air tank there is no need to get the motive bottle when using the dry method. just by the correct master cylinder adapter and convert the hose to a compressor fitting. be sure to only fill the tank to 10-15 psi. the plastic bottle is convenient but for the cost you could buy an air tank and use it for other stuff.

 

[Morde5]

Great thread! Thanks! I have been using Motive for a while and have been very happy but never thought of the dry method. Excellent idea and will try it next time. The compressor is also a good idea, although a bit scary. The only thing I did on my Motive is to replace their horrible pressure gauge with good quality, liquid filled stainless steel pressure gauge. Works great!

 

[dingosatemy981]

what an anti-social bunch. so many want to do this by themselves instead of having a buddy over, drink beer and talk Porsche

great tip on using an air tank or compressor as an alternative to the bottle