[SecondTimeAround]

I recently purchased a 2015 2.7L 981 moderately optioned PDK with under 8K miles on line from a large Porsche Dealer in Florida. Shipped it to NY. Not seen personally, just video walkarounds and pictures. I have done this kind of purchase many times before, so comfortable with remote buying, especially if CPO. Unfortunately, I am having to test out the CPO warranty immediately upon receiving the car. Are some dealers playing "kick the can"?

The Good:
1) CPO car with clean Carfax and maintenance records.
2) Mint condition interior and exterior, as you would hope for in a low mile car.
3) It already had full front PPF put on by previous owner which included the lower body panels all the way to the back of car, so a nice bonus worth probably ~$1500-$2000, and would indicate to me that the owner wanted to protect the investment. I was planning to do that once I got car, so great having it already.
4) No dreaded falling headliner or warped door panel issues (yet).
5) Even though it was a bit higher priced than a non-CPO of similar vintage, I negotiated what I considered to be a very good deal. CPO warranty probably worth about $2k to me.
6) Dealer also did the 40K service (a ~$2K dealer service value which would be needed even though low miles, as car age indicated it), so no major service needed soon.
7) Tires were only 1 year old (based on tire date code) and had 80% tread left, so no dry rot to worry about.
8) Dealer represented to me that battery was also replaced during CPO process, another (~$700 dealer value).
9) Enclosed shipment to me, and was paid by dealer (another ~$1600 value). I should have a ready to enjoy car. So far, very pleased with deal... Sounds good, doesn't it?

The Bad:
1) Received car with dash indicating car battery low, need to run for a while.
2) Ran car but battery dead next day.
3) Put on charger, but never reaches maintenance level. Noticed battery date code was 51-21, so not a new battery. Also noticed battery was a Varta 68ah, 680CCA battery, stock number was a VW code. Close spec, but not the correct one for this car, and certainly not new.
4) Also noticed a constant relay clicking sound going on and persistent amp draw when car was off and key out, which was killing battery quickly (trouble shooting covered in depth in complaint forum here).
5) Also noticed headlights, although very clear (no UV hazing) was exhibiting the beginning of common uv coating crazing, (known poor quality issue, not pleased, but it is a 8 yr old car).
6) Also noticed that the cabin filters were not replaced. This should have been part of the 40K service.

Footnote, called the dealer. They sent me the filters for no charge, and I put them in myself. Also mentioned the battery and charging issue. They apologized, said filters were an oversight, and maybe it is a defective battery. Advised to go to local dealer. Said it would be covered by CPO if defective.

The Ugly:
1) Brought to local dealer. Said battery tested OK, but could be on way out, so they suggested I replace battery. They did not identify the current draw issue. They also thought it may be bad battery related.
2) Local dealer would not cover the battery under CPO, but would be happy to install a new one for ~$700. Suggested I reach out to selling dealer for reimbursement. Crickets from them, so I just bought my own proper spec aftermarket battery, installed it and registered the new battery in computer to rule out battery as the source of problems.
3) Dealer advised me headlights would not be covered under CPO (even though some owners have had replaced under CPO, this dealer would not put in a claim for it). Probably not bad enough to be considered dangerous. I am fussy though. May go to plan B and attempt to restore them or just replace lenses)
4) Rapid battery drain continued even with new battery installed, so problem is not the battery. Did in depth trouble shooting on my own and isolated what may be a problem originating in the instrument cluster (could be something else, but car set to go back to my local dealer for a second time next week for investigation/repair)

The conclusion:
I wonder if some dealers use a CPO warranty to play "kick the can" back to Porsche NA by letting potentially expensive repairs that would have been charged to their sales department end up getting paid by warranty once the car leaves the lot. Although I am very happy with the car and the purchase price I paid, my out of pocket cost for the new battery is not worth the aggravation of escalating it to Porsche NA for recourse. I needed battery now, so bit the modest bullet. Not a great customer experience, but so be it. As far as the electrical issue is concerned, it was obviously present when car was serviced in Florida, but was either missed or ignored, and became the NY dealers headache to resolve (thus the "kick the can" reference).

I am hopeful the outcome will be fine in the end. I am not driving it right now as it is winter, but having to do the multiple trips to the dealer to correct a situation I never should have had is not a lot of fun for a car I have not even driven (except taking it to the dealer).

Anyone else experience this kind of CPO aggravation? CPO is supposed to create a more secure investment and avoid need to get a PPI, or face expensive bills later. I am still happy that I have the CPO, as if not, this could have been an expensive proposition to correct. Just not a great purchase experience with the selling dealer sticking me with the time and effort needed to get what should have been dealt with in the CPO inspection process addressed.

 

[GT3Twenty10]

Battery: these cars eat them unless you get a Ctek trickle charger (get one!! Do it now!) these cars sitting for any length of time usually a dead battery (Ctek is your friend). As for the stealership…. Good luck!! They basically suck and don’t give two chits about you, unless you spend more money as 5 minutes later they won’t remember nor care…. Great car! Get a new battery and most of the issues will be solved

 

[CinciOH]

I believe I read on this forum that it is very important that you actually lock the car - even if it is sitting in your garage. In your specific case, no way battery went that quick because of it, but once they fix the real issue, remember to lock it. I always locked the car in the garage and battery was still working properly when I preventatively replaced it after 6 years. Good luck.

 

[Boristhespyder]

Never locked it in my entire ownership in the garage, never had an issue. Any modern car will draw a battery down left without a tender long enough, the days of the clock being the only draw are long gone. As for CPO, I needed a new air vent, the dealer couldn't have been nicer, Porsche either. Of course, that was a ground ball item I put in myself. The tech was thinking about sitting in those new buckets in his already sullied work pants so I worked it out with the dealer to bring him the old one the next day, went home with Porsche instructions from the service manual. Key actually as the unlock is a tiny tab easy to miss..

 

[GT3Twenty10]

Never locked it in my entire ownership in the garage, never had an issue. Any modern car will draw a battery down left without a tender long enough, the days of the clock being the only draw are long gone. As for CPO, I needed a new air vent, the dealer couldn't have been nicer, Porsche either. Of course, that was a ground ball item I put in myself. The tech was thinking about sitting in those new buckets in his already sullied work pants so I worked it out with the dealer to bring him the old one the next day, went home with Porsche instructions from the service manual. Key actually as the unlock is a tiny tab easy to miss..

Same here… I never even take the key out, in any car. Have it-take them!!

 

[Boristhespyder]

That's not my angle at all, my hood is safe today anyway. Anybody comes in the house while I'm here is going to meet my friend Sam. Samuel L Colt. Locking a convertible is situational at best.

 

[deilenberger]

Guys - you really SHOULD look up the thread he has going on diagnostics for the battery issue. Short version - he has a CTEK and the current draw exceeds the output from the CTEK, so even on the CTEK the battery goes dead, it just takes longer. He has a NEW battery in it - stop blaming the battery for something that has happened with two batteries (and the first one checked OK at the dealers, but he replaced it despite that.) Please take the time when a thread is mentioned to look at it before responding.

981 Parasitic Battery Drain - Troubleshooting done - Who...

Have an issue with battery drain while car off, asleep and unlocked. I am providing my diagnostics that identified the following results, and my conclusion as to source of problem, but I have no idea what a solution could be: 1) After car goes 'to sleep" (dash displays blank out) there is are...

www.planet-9.com

 

[deilenberger]

OK - on topic - CPO

I suspect it depends on the dealer. Certainly, a dealer who is selling a car remotely and knows he isn't going to see you storming into the showroom yelling about your CPO car may be tempted to let some things slide. It sounds like they might have here.. it would surprise me that they never experienced the starting/dead-battery issue that you did. And never noticed the clicking noise. That's really I think your primary complaint. There is a CPO checklist that a mechanic has to sign off on - if I was buying a CPO car remotely I'd insist on having a completed copy of that checklist. I haven't personally seen one, so I can't say if there is a section on testing the battery for capacity.. they should have noticed it wasn't the correct battery, but "never attribute to malice that which can be explained by incompetence."

Hopefully, with the detailed troubleshooting you've done, and the fact that you can demonstrate the clicking relays issue the new dealer's service department will get it sorted out. I had a Porsche CPO warranty on my first Cayenne.. and I found that a dealer some distance from me, who had not sold the car to me, was much more enthusiastic or dedicated to customer satisfaction, and they went above and beyond in making me happy with my CPO car... (to the extent once they had the Cayenne for a few days, they swapped out an Audi loaner they'd given me - mixed dealership - with a Panamera, dropping it off and taking the Audi away from my house - about 50 miles from the dealership.)

 

[SecondTimeAround]

Already replaced the battery, have a trickle charger, and probably will never lock it unless out and about as stored in my garage. Don’t know if that lock or unlock theory is fact or fiction regarding battery drawdown. Locking car also activates alarm, so certainly will draw some small current if armed. Also if battery dies, and car is locked, you better have the manual spare key handy as won’t be able to get in to open frunk to jump battery. I generally would not leave key in ignition as that does activate some electrical systems and if battery does die, it will get stuck in ignition until you jump the car. Don’t know if those systems activated by key will time out and go to sleep or not if key in ignition. As far as trickle charger goes, I don’t plan on connecting it unless I plan on not driving it for more than 2 weeks. Not going to plug it in every time I garage it. I have a battery monitor attached (antigravity lead acid monitor) that will send me an alert when the battery drops below levels I designate, so I will get a heads up if it goes down too much. All I need to get sorted out at dealer now is fixing the amp draw problem. Then I will be happy.

 

[SecondTimeAround]

I do have a copy of the cpo report. All it shows in battery section is that battery tested to 80% capacity and passed. I suspect not a load test. On another note, I also have the 40k service invoice that shows cabin filters were replaced (which in fact were not) so hope the spark plugs were done, as that way my major desire out of all the services performed in the 40k service. Pain in the neck to verify that due to difficulty getting to them. Because of these cumulative issues, I don’t have a warm and fuzzy feeling about the competence levels and attention to detail performed prepping the car to ship. Maybe a rush rush job.

 

[Noah Fect]

Guys - you really SHOULD look up the thread he has going on diagnostics for the battery issue.

Actually read the OP's post and the rest of the thread before commenting with useless, inapplicable, or already-considered advice? Get outta here with that crazy talk

 

[Ernest72]

I would pull the easiest spark plug and check. Don’t want to wait another 6 years and find out it’s been 12 years and have trouble.

 

[Platinum5150]

It sounds like the selling dealer performed a totally half assed CPO certification. I could be wrong, but I'm pretty sure I have read that there is a high level of accountability for this process and if not performed properly there are adverse / costly consequences for the dealer.

Just food for thought once you get your car sorted.

 

[Chris(NJ)]

Although I can't really help w/ the battery draw issue. I am curious what carrier you used and what they charged you to ship from FL>NY.
Also, not giving me confidence in CPO'd vehicles lol.

 

[SecondTimeAround]

Dealer arranged it. I did have a quote from Montway though. Was about $1300 enclosed. Was a fair deal but prices can vary base on time of year and demand at the time. Actually a cheaper quote than dealer had to pay. They paid about $1600.

Cpo warranty is worth it in my opinion, especially in out of state not in person deals where arranging ppi remotely is harder. Unfortunately my purchase seemed to rely on getting an existing problem fixed after delivery, as opposed to fixing it before. Not happy about that.

 

[Chris(NJ)]

Dealer arranged it. I did have a quote from Montway though. Was about $1300 enclosed. Was a fair deal but prices can vary base on time of year and demand at the time. Actually a cheaper quote than dealer had to pay. They paid about $1600.

Cpo warranty is worth it in my opinion, especially in out of state not in person deals where arranging ppi remotely is harder. Unfortunately my purchase seemed to rely on getting an existing problem fixed after delivery, as opposed to fixing it before. Not happy about that.

Oh interesting, so you didn't even have to pay to have it shipped? Porsche ate the cost? Did they ship to another dealer by you?
Sorry, I know this is a little off topic from the original post.

 

[SecondTimeAround]

Shipped directly to me. Not something you normally would expect to get paid for by dealer, but every car negotiation is unique.

 

[Abt12]

I tried to buy a 981 GTS CPO from a dealer in socal to ship to Boston. They came down a bit in price, great. Had a PPI done but stupidly at a shop they recommended, and it was less than worthless - didn't send a single picture, said everything was totally fine except the tires the dealer already said they were going to replace.

Had a friend in the area go out to see the car, he identified a couple missing trim pieces on front bumper and a lot of paint damage from scraping on curbs. They agreed to repair.

At this point I think they decided they had put too much money into the car. When they sent me the purchase agreement, there was a $1400 upcharge for GPS tracking I hadn't been informed about or agreed to. (not Porsche tracking, a super cheap aftermarket tracker). I asked them to remove it as it wasn't in the original advertised price on the website, you had to click allllll the way through to the final buy stage to find it hidden under "fees". They said they'd walk from the deal if I didn't agree. They then tried to have me sign the CA paperwork saying that that item was optional and NOT a condition of sale. When they started playing hardball I had even given them the CA code that clearly states they can't do this, they didn't give a f.

It got sketchier when I realized they had set up my cash purchase as a single payment loan, complete with tons of restrictions and everything else that comes along with a loan.

The final nail in the coffin was a clause hidden in the contract saying the window sticker overrode EVERYTHING in the contract if it disagreed. No exceptions. And they didn't include the window sticker in the packet. They could have sold me a damn yugo and as long as the window sticker stated it, they'd technically be right.

I ended up walking, nearly gave up on buying a Porsche full stop because this soured me to the brand a ton. almost 6 months later, I just bought a 781 GTS from a non-dealer last week.

I haven't yet but very tempted to write PCNA and the CA dealer licensing board.

 

[deilenberger]

I ended up walking, nearly gave up on buying a Porsche full stop because this soured me to the brand a ton. almost 6 months later, I just bought a 781 GTS from a non-dealer last week.

I haven't yet but very tempted to write PCNA and the CA dealer licensing board.

That would be a good thing. When you write to PCNA - address it to Dr. Kjell Gruner - CEO/President of PCNA. Make it a polite factual letter explaining your disappointment with the treatment you received and how it caused you to look to a private party to buy the car you wanted rather than one CPO'd by Porsche. After you write it - sit on it overnight, re-read it - there will likely be things you want to change/correct. Then have it read by someone else for comments/editing. You want to make an impression with the letter.

I'm certain Gruner won't see the letter (unless PCNA has changed) - but - it WILL be replied to and the issues will be addressed. They may say "Dealers are an independent entity.. blah, blah, blah, that they have little control over" - but the truth is - they have a LOT of control over dealers, especially if the dealer actions reflect poorly on the brand. They can hold back what's called "trunk-money" (rebates for advertising) and car allocations - the dealer might not get the GT4 allocation he was hoping to make a score on. Just make the letter professional and to the point and I suspect you'll be delighted with the outcome (PCNA has been known to issue a Porsche gift card in some reasonable amount when they receive one of these reports. Probably doesn't happen every time, but it has happened... personal experience..)

Please post up the response you get from them.. I'm sure all of us would be interested.

And - welcome to Planet-9, the Friendly Porsche Forum. When you have a chance, please visit New Member Introductions and fill us in on your new GTS and a bit of background on your car history. Photos are always welcome in an intro posting!

 

[Chris(NJ)]

Can we start using dealership names or exact locations lol. Would really help knowing who to avoid or or seek out communication with.
For instance, I have a favorites folder w/ dealers I've had good experiences with so far. As I slowly build the list, I'll obviously only search their sites for the next car.