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Seriously thinking about exhaust system upgrades. Currently leaning towards the Carnewal GT exhaust modification of the stock exhaust and the addition of either the Fabspeed or Cargraphics headers with 200 cell cats. Trying to determine if there is really any discernable difference (quality, performance, construction, etc.) between the Fabspeed and the Cargraphics headers, other than the cost increase with the Cargraphics.
 

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The cargraphics design was modified by BGB based on their racing experience and are designed for more mid-range torque increase. There is a serious price difference and I have never seen the Fabspeed (which cost less), but my cargraphics are great......
 
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Seriously thinking about exhaust system upgrades. Currently leaning towards the Carnewal GT exhaust modification of the stock exhaust and the addition of either the Fabspeed or Cargraphics headers with 200 cell cats. Trying to determine if there is really any discernable difference (quality, performance, construction, etc.) between the Fabspeed and the Cargraphics headers, other than the cost increase with the Cargraphics.
You might consider FVD as well. They use 2 1/2 inch tubing. I believe the others are 2 inch, so the FVD might have less back pressure. Whether that is a good thing or not is for the experts to weigh in on.
FVD Brombacher Online Shop - BES98111200SHD - Sport Headers, 2012+ 981 Cayman / Boxster with 200 Cell Tri Metal "HD" Sportcats - EXHAUST → Tuning → Headers
 

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These prices are hilarious, $3800 for some headers.
 

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FVD claims on their website that they weld the header pipe curves from multiple pipe pieces rather than bend them from a single pipe on a machine. They say that bending stretches the outer wall and creates weakness. They also state a full plate single flange and additional engineering on the inside of the headers to maximize exhaust flow. I guess that this is why they are pricier than Fabspeed or Cargraphics.

i freely admit that this is out of my element and I am curious to see what others post on here.

My question: Do you need ECU tuning to make the most of swapping headers from stock?
 

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I considered the same choice and wound up buying Fabspeed headers. Both Cargraphic and Fabspeed use the HJS HD 200 cell cats, which to me is an important consideration. The newer Cargraphic design has slightly longer tubes than Cargraphic's first offering for the 981. Fabspeed's tube length looks almost exactly like the first generation of Cargraphic. In general, shorter tubes = low-mid range torque gain; longer tubes = mid-high range torque gain. I'm not sure if the few inches of extra length of the Cargraphic tubes would really make a huge shift in torque to higher in the rev range, but I think that's the main difference between the two units. I bought Fabspeed because they were considerably cheaper, especially with a discount that I found thru a non-sponsor. An additional consideration is that all of the Fabspeed 981 parts are make-to-order, so plan on waiting 6-8 weeks for delivery. I purchased a Cargraphic catback and it was on my doorstep in less than a week, shipped from Germany. I'm very happy with my Fabspeed headers but I think that the Cargraphic's are also a great choice. I found the build quality to be similar between the two companies; both are very good.
 

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FVD claims on their website that they weld the header pipe curves from multiple pipe pieces rather than bend them from a single pipe on a machine. They say that bending stretches the outer wall and creates weakness. They also state a full plate single flange and additional engineering on the inside of the headers to maximize exhaust flow. I guess that this is why they are pricier than Fabspeed or Cargraphics.

i freely admit that this is out of my element and I am curious to see what others post on here.

My question: Do you need ECU tuning to make the most of swapping headers from stock?
no doubt they are quality parts, but once they make one set, they just throw the metal in a jig, weld it up and its easy. the 3800 price tag is what some people would pay for completely custom, 1 off pieces.
 
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Seriously thinking about exhaust system upgrades. Currently leaning towards the Carnewal GT exhaust modification of the stock exhaust and the addition of either the Fabspeed or Cargraphics headers with 200 cell cats. Trying to determine if there is really any discernable difference (quality, performance, construction, etc.) between the Fabspeed and the Cargraphics headers, other than the cost increase with the Cargraphics.

The Fabspeed headers would be a great addition to your 981. They make great power and torque across the power band and also add some exhaust tone. Coupled with a modified OEM exhaust, you will be very pleased with the end result. As you also mentioned, the Fabspeed headers are priced lower then the alternate you are considering - on top of that, there is also a P9 member discount on all Fabspeed products. Feel free to shoot me an email or PM if you have any questions or would like to place an order, I would be happy to help!

-Joe Neill
[email protected]

 

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Not trying to drive this thread off topic, but was VERY interested in adding sport headers with cats to my GTS, however, after contacting my dealership's service manager, he said PCNA could use the headers against an engine warranty issue. I fully understand the Magnuson-Moss warranty act, however, it seems like an easy out for PCNA if an engine had issues. I hate to sound like a wimp, but I don't want to fork out for a new long block if PCNA denies the warranty...

What do you guys think? Anyone the least bit worried?

BTW, my service manager told me I could go nuts with just about anything after the cats and PCNA would have no issue with it... Really stinks as several members here have added either the Fabspeed or Cargraphics headers with cats and it really seems to bring in a good boost in low end torque (smoother too) as well a nice sound change...
 

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Not trying to drive this thread off topic, but was VERY interested in adding sport headers with cats to my GTS, however, after contacting my dealership's service manager, he said PCNA could use the headers against an engine warranty issue. I fully understand the Magnuson-Moss warranty act, however, it seems like an easy out for PCNA if an engine had issues. I hate to sound like a wimp, but I don't want to fork out for a new long block if PCNA denies the warranty...

What do you guys think? Anyone the least bit worried?

BTW, my service manager told me I could go nuts with just about anything after the cats and PCNA would have no issue with it... Really stinks as several members here have added either the Fabspeed or Cargraphics headers with cats and it really seems to bring in a good boost in low end torque (smoother too) as well a nice sound change...
It really shouldn't matter if headers are added they are a bolt on that doesn't change a thing internally on the engine. If they want to deny the warranty they will find a way. If the the dme is clean with no over rev's I'm not sure they can find a reason other than claiming track abuse.

Cman21
 

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On second thought... I COULD have an indy shop put them on. If a failure would occur, I could have said indy put the stock manifolds back on before the trip to the dealer? Would be a small price to pay if the engine were to grenade... Thoughts?
 

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On second thought... I COULD have an indy shop put them on. If a failure would occur, I could have said indy put the stock manifolds back on before the trip to the dealer? Would be a small price to pay if the engine were to grenade... Thoughts?
I don't think there have been many 9a1 engine failures especially with PDK transmissions

Cman21
 

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On second thought... I COULD have an indy shop put them on. If a failure would occur, I could have said indy put the stock manifolds back on before the trip to the dealer? Would be a small price to pay if the engine were to grenade... Thoughts?
I think it's highly unlikely that exhaust headers could be successfully used as an argument to deny warranty coverage on engine internals, but as you suggest, the headers are very easy to install and remove. I've seen cheap cats disintegrate, dumping a bunch of crud into the catback, and I imagine that would result in a denial of warranty on the catback. But other than that it would be a big stretch for a dealer or Porsche to deny a claim on engine internals if the engine is otherwise unmodified. I think flashes and intake mods pose a bigger risk of warranty denial. Just my 2 cents.
 

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Hey Joe,
Am I reading the chart correctly? That we lose HP/torque in the sub 3K range?

The Fabspeed headers would be a great addition to your 981. They make great power and torque across the power band and also add some exhaust tone. Coupled with a modified OEM exhaust, you will be very pleased with the end result. As you also mentioned, the Fabspeed headers are priced lower then the alternate you are considering - on top of that, there is also a P9 member discount on all Fabspeed products. Feel free to shoot me an email or PM if you have any questions or would like to place an order, I would be happy to help!

-Joe Neill
[email protected]

 

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Ive seen a few Fabspeed header dyno charts and I think the drop in HP below 3k is there, and real. I have FS headers (had them on my GTS, now my GT4) and if there's a drop it's not all that noticeable. But the bump at higher rpms is quite noticeable. These cars don't do much below 5k anyway. Yes there's real power and torque available between 3k and 5k, but it goes crazy as the revs rise (ie crazy good.)
 

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Ive seen a few Fabspeed header dyno charts and I think the drop in HP below 3k is there, and real. I have FS headers (had them on my GTS, now my GT4) and if there's a drop it's not all that noticeable. But the bump at higher rpms is quite noticeable. These cars don't do much below 5k anyway. Yes there's real power and torque available between 3k and 5k, but it goes crazy as the revs rise (ie crazy good.)
If you compare the two, there is a difference in the length of the tubes from each exhaust port to the collector. This dramatically affects the power band (same for intake). Generally, shorter length tubes generate more HP at high RPM and longer tubes generate power/torque at lower RPM. The formula for HP is HP = TQ*RPM/5252. What that means is with a constant torque, as you go higher in RPM, before 5252 RPM, you get less than 1 HP per ft-lb. Above that, you get a multiplicative effect. At 7800 RPM, that multiplier is approximately 1.5 x TQ. So a few ft-lbs at high RPM can generate a lot of HP.

The fact that our cars love being at high RPM and that's where the biggest HP gains can be made, is why some companies will design their headers one way vs others.

As I alluded to earlier, most of our cars (S, GTS, GT4) have intake flapper valves that adjust the effective length and optimize the intake air pulses for given RPM bands, giving a wider HP band. In 993, this was the VarioRam system. My 3.8 X51 engine has a plenum flapper plus flappers in each port runner to the heads, giving higher HP over an even wider RPM range.

So long story short, you need to pick the hardware to fit your driving style/needs.
 
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