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I quite agree.

FG is also loosing its credibility within the motoring circles. Last nights episode is evident of this.

Personally, i find it quite surprising indeed that the Cayman, a lighter, lower and perfectly (comparatively superior) balanced machine would fall short of winning the slalom. I wouldn't go as far as saying that Nidell's claims of repeating that run was necessary due to Plato putting down more rubber, but any knowledge on these cars or at least a shred of common sense would not expect a larger, wallowing front engine car to have come out on top as it did.

Secondly, again i ask why is a drift any test whatsoever on a car's handling? Assuming this is the case, any car pitted against say a C63 AMG will instantly lose. It was obvious that the LSD-excluded Cayman would fall short of such a job yet surprisingly, they voted it the winner for that round.

So the car that should have won the first round lost, while vice versa for the second. The third round was always going to happen nonetheless and they both commented on the lack of grunt towards the top end. Nothing new there and common knowledge. But what I think they are trying to do is change their "legendary shootouts" to something akin to the Top Gear formula which is to drop all reality of the tests and provide a show purely for the television. A bad decision that doesn't work.
 

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What buoys me is that a BMW, with more power and turbos and an infinitely better driver, barely beats a Cayman with 245 hp and a far lesser driver. I also agree that several laps later, the Cayman would win. But the drift thing was just BS. The slalom bothered me a bit, tho.
 

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Yes. I am sure things would have been different if it had been a Cayman S. The CS out gunned the BMW M3 in a recent Top Gear magazine article.
 

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Quite simply, this is entertainment, not an objective comparison test. It's fun for what it is, but shouldn't be interpreted to be what it isn't.
 

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Discussion Starter #26
Err, no ... Top Gear is entertainment, Fifth Gear is just shoddy television.

:D

Only because the BBC have a bigger budget paid for by taxing us with the so called TV license! By the way, did you know that if you watch TV via your PC/Mac on line, you do not have to pay the license, only stipulation is that the program / film cant be shown at the same time it is being broadcast. :cheers:
 

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Yes. I am sure things would have been different if it had been a Cayman S. The CS out gunned the BMW M3 in a recent Top Gear magazine article.
Can that article be accessed anywhere on the net? I want to read it.
 

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I am sure this BMW is a very nice car, and comparable to the Cayman when you lower the CG, move the engine to where the back seat is, and replace suspension and brakes.
Oh, yes, also remove most of the sound proofing and install a bad BOSE stereo.

I bought my Cayman S as winter-wagen replacement for my old BMW.
It was a very good car.
It is not a Porsche.
For good or bad, that is.

But, after all, who cares what is faster or heavier or more this or that, when it all really comes down to personal preferences and taste.
 

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I watched this to last night. Now I usually try to catch both Fifth Gear and Top Gear. FG is a lower budget version of TG but not to bad at that. Top Gear is great for it's fantastic productions values, always nice to see the latest metal filmed in this context. Photography, sound, etc, all top notch.

As for any "critic" or info they try to pass I automatically draw a blank, totally useless utter ****, same for lap times, how more inconsistent and tv/drama prone can they be? (black stig/white stig/Kovalainen Stig/Damp/Wet/Very Wet/Foggy/Dry bla bla laps). The humour gets tired very quickly, JC is at most bearable. Tiff and the other gang are just a little bit lame. Well it's a Tv Show for the mass audience, not a program for the auto enthusiast.

If something like EVO magazine would award the BMW 135 5 stars and the Cayman 4 stars, now that would get my alarms ringing (cause I'm courting the idea of buying a Cayman S!). Just enjoy the features and ignore the "verdicts".

PS: The BMW is rather ugly to!
 

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Just watched the "test", agree with those above, it is just entertainment for the masses, not much hard facts to get out of this really.

There are still a few serious auto magasines out there, providing useful information and actually testing the cars.
I hope at least some of them survive our "age of stupidification" (hard to translate from Norwegian..), where simple messages in tabloid format is becoming the general level for information.

The BMW being ugly should not be a problem, because you just replace the body while doing the engine relocation.
 

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As far as TV auto mags go, I think Top Gear is the most entertaining.

Motorweek, for example, is plain annoying. It's some loud annoying guy shouting stats at me for a half hour. Where did they get that guy? They also never really give a strong opinion about any car.

If I want stats, I'll go to Autoblog or read Autoweek. If I want to be entertained, I'll watch Top Gear. It never deigns to be more than a show about boys and their toys, which makes it pure entertainment.
 

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Oh I've built one a long time ago and built another one recently and guess what... mine came out $45K! and I did not get a automatic transmission. MANUAL ALL the way! not to save cost but you know what I mean.


SO ya... the way I would want one spec'ed $45K!

But then again my bare bare bare bones Cayman S was LOADS more expensive than the 135i... ouch. and has less HP :(
On a side note. I noticed that you had tinted your Cayman S at 35% on the sides, and 15% in the back. Don't you mean the other way around? If not, is 35% on the sides legal in Southern California? I'm moving back to Southern Cal, and was just wondering what is legal and what's not. Thanks.
 

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Can that article be accessed anywhere on the net? I want to read it.
I don't know. The article I refer to is in the January 2008 issue of Top Gear and can be found on page 166. It really praises the CS. For example, and I quote: " On Brittan's tricky B-roads Cayman (S) leaves M3 for dead. Just as you'd expect. " If you do a search, I believe the article is copied in full somewhere on this site. :)
 

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Bloody Wankers, the lot of them.

I wouldnt have a problem with the entertainment aspect of these two ham-fisting the cars around a track, but don't draw a conclusion as to which is a better car.
 

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On a side note. I noticed that you had tinted your Cayman S at 35% on the sides, and 15% in the back. Don't you mean the other way around? If not, is 35% on the sides legal in Southern California? I'm moving back to Southern Cal, and was just wondering what is legal and what's not. Thanks.
No I meant exactly that... 35% for the 4 side windows... passenger side and drivers side... and 15% on the rear hatch window.

35% means 35% light can be transmitted into the car... so 35% is lighter tint than 15% is.

I actually wanted about 25% but since the tinter I went to dont have that shade I settled for the lighter 35% and compensated for 15% dark tint in the rear to make it look darker.

and yes it illegal... tint for CA front is like 70%. which is so light might as well not have it. I'll deal with it when I get hassle / problems from the cops. I like my privacy.

here are some pics... it actually looks darker depending on the angle... these make it look a tiny bit lighter than it really is.
 

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Fifth Gear is one of those puerile programmes that makes me want to throw bricks at my TV :mad:

So they test a Cayman versus a 1 Series and one of the categories is how much smoke they can make while drifting it!!! Purleeeese! Utter childish rubbish, makes my blood boil! :wall:

And £6,000 cheaper? who are they kidding. Have you tried speccing a BMW recently? A halfway decently specced 135i would probably cost more than a basic Cayman, in the UK at least. The car that Plato was driving had the fancy leather interior and various other toys, so it was most certainly NOT a budget spec car.

Both the Cayman AND the BMW are excellent cars, I have no issues with that. I just cringe when I see so called auto journalism reduced to this level of inanity.
you brought it to the point John!

in last months edition of the Porsche Scene live you could read a lot about the Cayman and different ways of tuning - e.g. the Manthey Cayman.
...but what I wanted to tell is... they testet a serial Cayman S vs. a 997 S... on the short connection of the Hockenheimring. You all know we're talking about a 60hp difference - Porsche vs. Porsche! ...the Cayman was a tenth of a second quicker :) conclusion... the Cayman loves Curves!
...so how can a BMW in serial trim beat a Cayman? No doubt, it's a powerful car with an excellent handling... but being quick in accelleration or on a straight... that's easy. Being quick on a race track... that's the major difficulty.

coming back to the test 987 vs 997... I know that looks different on an other circuit, but... was nice to read ;)

Marcel.
 

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Think 5th gear are missing the point with Porsche. Its never been sold as a bargain , or cut price performance car. Its not intended to be good value for money , its prestige , like Rolls, Bentley and Ferrari. Not the fastest car on the planet , you can turbocharge a cateram for that , but a car with pedigree and heritage. The BMW marque has lost this association by cheapening the brand in an attempt to sell more cars , building cheaper versions and packing the biggest engines into them. BMW deserve credit to make a compact car with good handling , at a reasonable cost , and frugal to boot. Porsche should be kicked for not making the performance of their cars consitent with other manufacturers , they certainly have lost the edge in recent years. Nissan are now selling a 350 Z with 315 Bhp whilst porsche are still stuck with 295 in the Cayman S.
There are penty of mainstream cars that pack a bigger punch than many current porsche models, but very few that measure up in terms of brand status.
 

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Discussion Starter #39
There are penty of mainstream cars that pack a bigger punch than many current porsche models, but very few that measure up in terms of brand status.
I guess that more or less sums it up, in reality the Cayman is more then the sum of its (expensive) parts. I chose for a number of reasons, all personal, subjective and in truth , illogical. Its the same reason I have a valve based Hifi, not a Krell, its all down to what you want and what you are prepared to 'not have' to get it.
 
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