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Discussion Starter · #1 · (Edited)
Whenever I take the croc down to a well know local motorcycle road I always beat them around the corners. They tend to brake earlier, by then I've zoomed past them. Is it just me or do motorcycles in general take more care around the bends? Because of this I'm always gaining distance.
 

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That is not much of a surprise; bikes are much slower on corners; you know... two wheels.
 

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You have more contact with the ground with 4 tires and are in a fully enclosed auto with airbags and crumple zones. They only have 2 wheels and much larger consequences if they push too hard.
 

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Modern sportbikes, technically, have very similar cornering and braking capabilities as sports cars. And acceleration - significantly better. But, as other posters have pointed out, the skill to get to that level, and the consequences of screwing up, are another matter. On a lot of racetracks, with good driver/rider combinations, the bike should generally lead.

And a good sportbike is probably a lot closer in performance to a racing bike than a good sportscar is to a race car.

Both are great fun though!:cheers:
 

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..... On a lot of racetracks, with good driver/rider combinations, the bike should generally lead. ....QUOTE]

I think you'll find that cars hold almost all track records.

To the original poster - you probably already do, but, I think it goes without saying that we all need to be very respectful of any bikes we're driving near. I play with them in the mountains fairly regularly - but am very careful, even if we are going fast.
 

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Discussion Starter · #6 ·
I thought as much, I'm not pushing the car to the limits, but yere the bike has a lot more to loose should it make a wrong move. In any case it still puts a smile on my face :) love playing with those bikes.
 

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..... On a lot of racetracks, with good driver/rider combinations, the bike should generally lead. ....QUOTE]

I think you'll find that cars hold almost all track records.

To the original poster - you probably already do, but, I think it goes without saying that we all need to be very respectful of any bikes we're driving near. I play with them in the mountains fairly regularly - but am very careful, even if we are going fast.
I was referring to production models, not racing versions. Racing cars have the advantage of aero downforce and can pull 4+ lateral and braking g's, which of course even a MotoGP bike wouldn't be able to duplicate.

Otherwise race rider on production bike vs race driver in production car, I'll bet on the bike on most tracks. I'll do some digging to back that up - maybe the newer crop of cars like the GTR, etc have shifted the balance? But then bike tires are allowing over 1g lateral and you can pick lines better on a bike (ie. they're skinny).:cheers:
 

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2:01 vs 1:47 - Ferrari Scuderia vs Ducati Desmosedici (on slicks) @ Almeria in Spain

Both are top level examples of production machines. More examples to come...
 

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It depends on the piece of tarmac....some tracks are better for bikes and some for cars, but where a bike is better a Superkart will be better, purely because of 4 wheel grip.

On the street in most cases a well driven car will be faster than a bike, because you can push that bit harder in a car without too much fear, unlike a bike where more factors come into play.

The bike wins on thrills in general though, and is still the most raw vehicle out on the roads and that you've gotta love!
 

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I think bikes are generally slower in tighter corners, you can only lean so much before you fall!
 

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On a reasonable road (not dirt), it's the driver/Rider, and a confidant rider should destroy the Cayman S everytime in turns.

I'd say these days there probably aren't too many confidant riders that truly know their bikes. It seems more about show these days.

I used to crush my buddies on over a mountain pass on an SV650 when they rode a Honda 929, Honda RC51, Ducati 996, Yamaha R6. Same thing when I was on the TL1000S as well.
 

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On the top level of car vs. bike, the question has been answered I believe. Valentino Rossi on his Yamaha was timed in his pole position lap in Malaysia (I think) and so was Schumi with his Ferrari F1 also on a pole position winning lap in the same cirquit. To make a long story short, for every 3 laps the bike would cover at that pace, the F1 would cover 4! I think you can find it on youtube.

However, at a lesser level, other things come into play, such as (a) a good sports bike is closer to a racing machine than a car is and (b) screwing up on a bike can kill you much easier than in a car. Ceteris paribus, the bike will eat the car alive at the straights, and the car will regain what was lost at the corners. If it's a twisty track rather than a mainly straight one with a few twisties, the good sportscar can pull it off. YMMV.
 

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Learning to drive a sports car at 8/10ths is child's play compared to the reaching the same level on a sportbike, and the learning curve only gets steeper from there.

Having raced and streeted bikes for years I can tell you if there's a car wanting to "run" with a rider on the street they usually let it go, and allow a gap before getting back to pace. Please don't try to run with bikes, they're not interested in playing with 3000# cages. They have nothing to prove (and will leave a CS as roadkill in a straight) and everything to lose.
 

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I was referring to production models, not racing versions. ..QUOTE]

Fair enough.

2:01 vs 1:47 - Ferrari Scuderia vs Ducati Desmosedici (on slicks) @ Almeria in Spain...QUOTE]

Slicks aren't 'production'. Sounds like it may be fairly close. I wonder what say a Viper ACR vs a top stock bike would do around say the nurburgring.

On a reasonable road (not dirt), it's the driver/Rider, and a confidant rider should destroy the Cayman S everytime in turns....QUOTE]

I agree wholeheartedly about the rider/driver - the same holds true in cars. However, it has not been my experience that bikes can corner harder (on street tires). Of course most any bike can waste most any car at will on the straights.

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Having raced and streeted bikes for years I can tell you if there's a car wanting to "run" with a rider on the street they usually let it go, and allow a gap before getting back to pace. Please don't try to run with bikes, they're not interested in playing with 3000# cages. They have nothing to prove (and will leave a CS as roadkill in a straight) and everything to lose.
I agree....except...I find, once they get to know you, the better riders will readily play and they tell me they enjoy it. These same better riders sometimes go faster than me (and sometimes not). I even ride/drive with some of my bike friends on purpose - as they are the main ones who will even 'come out and play'. I don't see very many sports cars in the mountains, mainly sport bikes. Heck, by now the sport bikes wave at me like they do each other - so I feel a kindred spirit.:cheers:
 

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So, about 3s faster than the bike in that case. Wonder if they ever got in a dry lap as all the video shows a fair amount of wet?
 

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If I were on the same road with a sport bike at speed I would give the rider A LOT of room. I've been on the Dragon with a few sport bikes while I was in my car and I would not like to think about hitting one in the event the rider goes down.

It never crossed my mind to pass one. However, I have pointed by more than a few.
 

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Exactly, thank you Alan.
As a rider, you just don't know/have confidence in the condition of the pavement/surface on the street
like you would on the track and the consequences are, well, you know.
I've seen too many guys go down on gravel/oil/fluids trying to push unknown conditions on the street.
On a track, it's a different world for a bike where as for a car, you can get away
with poor/unknown conditions on the street with much less risk/cost/pain/injury.
To closely follow a guy on a bike making that mistake, on the street, with a car,
is really asking for something to eventually happen.
You know the saying.
 

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Discussion Starter · #19 ·
Having read posts from experienced riders I can now appreciate the delicate lines bikers negotiate on public roads. It all makes sense because there is only a sliver of rubber between the bike & the road as opposed to 4 wide tires. It's in the corners where the grip & rubber counts most not the straights. I know for next time to drive with caution when playing the mountain roads with our motorcyle friends. :)
 
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