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Discussion Starter · #21 ·
Re: Le Mans 2018

Isn't that the same turn that the Aston Martin driver die at in 2013?
Yes. Tetre Rouge is where Allan Simonsen had his accident.
 

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Re: Le Mans 2018

It’s ON!! Arguably, the most important Sports Car Race on the Planet. 86th running of THE RACE. Rooting for the Mid-Engine ROAD ROCKETS!
Go PORSCHE RSR’s!!!!!
 

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Discussion Starter · #23 ·
Re: Le Mans 2018

Rothmans livery #91 got caught out by first safety car and loss big track position. Also took a carbon fibre wing to the face when a proto got stupid.

#92 Pink Pig is flying.
Looks like BMW was sandbagging a lot during qual.

Alonso is relentless in traffic.
 

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Re: Le Mans 2018

Go PORSCHE RSR’s!!!!!
You can call it an orange, or a banana (like CNN) ;). But Porsche calls is a 911 RSR. And they are the only one's that matter. None of us matter in the least. We didn't build it. PAG builds it for Racing Teams.

The new 911 RSR

"The new Porsche 911 RSR is the result of passion, spirit of engineering, tradition and craftsmanship. It is the spearhead of the 911 family and has a single goal: to master the challenges in international GT endurance racing."


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For anyone watching part of the race on Velocity, do you notice anything weird? The hour or so I watched this afternoon, the only thing the commentators did was talking about the 911s. Once in a while they mentioned a Corvette or Ford GT but the 911s dominated the discussion.

Why is that weird? Because while they were talking, once in a while, you'd see maybe a LMP2 car flash its white highs to blow buy them. Virtual, NO discussion of LMP1 or LMP2 other than the chyron flashing Toyota in the lead.

Why is this significant? Because all the Tech trickles down from the LMP1 cars. What we might be watching the death bell for ICE racing, the beginning, but nevertheless the beginning of the end.

Since when were the commentator not interested in what is going on in LMP1?
 

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Discussion Starter · #25 ·
Re: Le Mans 2018

You can call it an orange, or a banana (like CNN) ;). But Porsche calls is a 911 RSR. And they are the only one's that matter. None of us matter in the least. We didn't build it. PAG builds it for Racing Teams.

The new 911 RSR

"The new Porsche 911 RSR is the result of passion, spirit of engineering, tradition and craftsmanship. It is the spearhead of the 911 family and has a single goal: to master the challenges in international GT endurance racing."


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For anyone watching part of the race on Velocity, do you notice anything weird? The hour or so I watched this afternoon, the only thing the commentators did was talking about the 911s. Once in a while they mentioned a Corvette or Ford GT but the 911s dominated the discussion.

Why is that weird? Because while they were talking, once in a while, you'd see maybe a LMP2 car flash its white highs to blow buy them. Virtual, NO discussion of LMP1 or LMP2 other than the chyron flashing Toyota in the lead.

Why is this significant? Because all the Tech trickles down from the LMP1 cars. What we might be watching the death bell for ICE racing, the beginning, but nevertheless the beginning of the end.

Since when were the commentator not interested in what is going on in LMP1?

You watched one hour out of 12 so far and drew a conclusion about the commentators? Brilliant.

Please stop asking rhetorical non sequitur questions which you then use to hijack the topic away to whatever agenda you're selling on that day. This is a thread about Le Mans 2018, not another thread for you to hijack into your usual bloviating on the future of the automotive industry. You seem to enjoy doing that in every single one of your post, no matter the topic. It's really annoying, the constant trolling/baiting act in every thread where you interject your opinions as fact on whatever the topic is getting old and is part of the reason this forum is dying a slow death.


They talked plenty about LMP1 at the beginning, but there is no race there. Toyota had it in the bag by turn 1 when Lotterer broke the nose on his Rebellion, and the SMP (which had no chance to catch the Toyotas on pace) that was in 3rd place crashed early into the night session. That's why they aren't talking about LMP1, because there is nothing to talk about. The only other thing to talk about in LMP1 is Alonso, but that story went out the window when Buemi being a dumbass got the #8 toyota a penalty for speeding in a slow zone. So there is no chance Alonso will be winning unless the #7 Toyota has a catastrophic failure.

GTE Pro has been the only category that has had any real racing, so they've been talking more about it than the other classes. Plus the Pink Pig and Rothman liveries are just crazy cool if you are an actual sportscar racing fan.


Core autosport #93 was in contention for the podium but they had an alternator failure. Then the #81 BMW had a suspension failure which cost them like 10 laps. Shame. Those 2 cars plus #91 and #92 looked like they were going to be battling all the way to the end.

If Dempsey-Proton can hold onto the GTE Am lead through the night, it's looking pretty good for Porsche.
 

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Re: Le Mans 2018

Two hours to go...the pink pig is flying! :)

But I’m amazed at how close things are in LM GTE Pro...I haven’t watched sports car or endurance racing in like forever, is it normally this tight?


Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk
 

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Re: Le Mans 2018

I was impressed that Velocity had the guts to cover the entire race end to end tapped into the European broadcast. Kudos to them for doing that. I watched a large percentage of the race except for getting a few hours sleep. I thought there was good work done to cover the cars in all classes. I am happy for Toyota but a tad hollow without and Audi or Porsche there but still you cannot take away from the sheer tenacity and outstanding result. I am an Alonso fan and really happy for him. He can be a character at times but a tip of the hat to someone like him who wants to be viewed as a complete, all around world class driver. Two F1 Championships, LeMans Champion, and gotta believe Indy 500 at some point. I was also really happy for SB, ex F1, Jensen Button taking a run at it too.
 

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Re: Le Mans 2018

911 RSR is more like CaymanRSR. What is the key difference between a GT4 and a GT3, engine placement. The 2017-18 911RSR is mid-engine so PORSCHE needs to be honest and call it what it is, a CAYMAN. Also, aren't they on shaky ground with this class of racing and not having the production levels? I don't follow all the regulations and changes in the rules but calling that car a 911 goes against every argument I hear why 911s are better than a Caymans. Porsche just proved what we knew all along.

Two great wins for the future of PORSCHE GTE racing ,"mid-engine".
 

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Congrats to Toyota. They spent $100 million and deserved to win. As I understand it, Porsche and Audi spent twice that much for their LMP1 wins, so in a way, Toyota achieved a relative bargain. (cost data is sourced from Sportscar365).

Alonso's night drive was spectacular!

Personally, I much prefer this type of racing to hyper-dollar F1 (Ferrari F1 budget last year = $470 million). The strategy of pit stops, night driving, actual repairs, non-hand grenade motors, driver changes, etc. all make it far more interesting to me.

I have done 5 or 6 night endurance races and it really changes everything about road racing (but my night racing was at Summit Point, WV where a cow once wandered onto the course during a night 4 hour event......I doubt that would happen at LeMans.) :)

I'm a particular fan of the LM-GTE classes. They are more like our real, actual road cars. I can *identify*. Also, cool to see Dempsey win in AM class. He was here at NJMP a while back.....super nice guy. BTW, one of Dempsey's regular co-drivers and partners is Michael Aventti. He was a bit too busy to drive this year. ;)

I fully understand why Porsche continues to call the RSR a "911". At this point, it's an iconic set of numerals for Porsche, even if it is just an accident caused by Peugeot naming practices. Porsche wisely wants to keep its loyal and profitable 911 fan-base happy. Who can blame them?

I also understand why the RSR has its engine in the middle. I used to teach physics. But as far as the RSR being an actual "911"?........I was born in the night but it wasn't last night. ;)
 

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Personally, I much prefer this type of racing to hyper-dollar F1 (Ferrari F1 budget last year = $470 million). The strategy of pit stops, night driving, actual repairs, non-hand grenade motors, driver changes, etc. all make it far more interesting to me.
I agree. I used to like F1 racing - even went to a few races - but it isn't much anymore. NASCAR stinks too.
 

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Interesting that Dempsey-Proton car was also a mid-engined 911. This is the first year that the Pro and AM class Prosches are essentially the same cars. I also thought it was interesting that Porsche had to carry more weight after their qualifying runs and still was the class of the field. It was a bit perplexing to me how relatively out of it the Corvettes were......I suspect that Corvette is really going to need to move to that mid-engine that is being bandied about to really stay highly competitive............the rest of the world has caught up and passed them by. And, they have always been good in tying racing and street cars together.

The $100Million referenced that Toyota spent? I think that is a bit on the light side of reality. One of the commentators alluded to that as well. If the effort for 2 cars was only $100million I suspect Porsche would still be in it. I can tell you from pretty good first hand knowledge that in 2002 the Audi R8 effort run by Joest in ALMS was about $220Million for their two car effort. Corvette was $32Million. I was in ALMS at the time with Team Rafanelli running the 550 Maranello for Olive Garden. Our budget was about $4.5Million for one car. And, we did surprisingly well with that small a budget..........no test mule, no wind tunnel............engines alone were about $1Million each (we had two) built by Elan Motorsports (race division of Panoz at the time).
 

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Very happy to see the Caymans... er..., I mean 911’s do well but, other than the few laps with Sebastian the whiner and the GTE 2nd place finisher, quite a boring race. Watched every second. But, B O R I N G.

Still made me proud to finally be in the Porsche family and own a mid-motor one at that.
 

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Re: Le Mans 2018

I was impressed that Velocity had the guts to cover the entire race end to end tapped into the European broadcast. Kudos to them for doing that. I watched a large percentage of the race except for getting a few hours sleep. I thought there was good work done to cover the cars in all classes. I am happy for Toyota but a tad hollow without and Audi or Porsche there but still you cannot take away from the sheer tenacity and outstanding result. I am an Alonso fan and really happy for him. He can be a character at times but a tip of the hat to someone like him who wants to be viewed as a complete, all around world class driver. Two F1 Championships, LeMans Champion, and gotta believe Indy 500 at some point. I was also really happy for SB, ex F1, Jensen Button taking a run at it too.
I drove to Indy last year to watch Alonso, and he delivered big time. He really had a shot at winning it. Well, until Honda engine blew up again :(
 
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Discussion Starter · #35 · (Edited)
Interesting that Dempsey-Proton car was also a mid-engined 911. This is the first year that the Pro and AM class Prosches are essentially the same cars. I also thought it was interesting that Porsche had to carry more weight after their qualifying runs and still was the class of the field. It was a bit perplexing to me how relatively out of it the Corvettes were......I suspect that Corvette is really going to need to move to that mid-engine that is being bandied about to really stay highly competitive............the rest of the world has caught up and passed them by. And, they have always been good in tying racing and street cars together.

The $100Million referenced that Toyota spent? I think that is a bit on the light side of reality. One of the commentators alluded to that as well. If the effort for 2 cars was only $100million I suspect Porsche would still be in it. I can tell you from pretty good first hand knowledge that in 2002 the Audi R8 effort run by Joest in ALMS was about $220Million for their two car effort. Corvette was $32Million. I was in ALMS at the time with Team Rafanelli running the 550 Maranello for Olive Garden. Our budget was about $4.5Million for one car. And, we did surprisingly well with that small a budget..........no test mule, no wind tunnel............engines alone were about $1Million each (we had two) built by Elan Motorsports (race division of Panoz at the time).
Any cool/fun stories from your time with Team Rafanelli? I figure back in those days it was a lot more loose/fun atmosphere, these days teams are all run like corporations I imagine.

Yeah, the GTE AM class is basically any GTE Pro car that is one year or older. So when the factory teams are done with the car from last year, they sell it to the AM class teams. It's why the AM class was dominated all last season by the 488 last year. Any AM team that had the "old" 488 had an advantage over the other AM teams that were still running the rear engined 991 and the old Aston.

So it's basically the same car now, just with caveat that the AM class has to have at least one bronze level driver i think. Or some combination of silver and bronze drivers, basically to make it a gentleman driver class. The Ford GT will be eligible for AM teams to purchase this year as well, so we might see some GTE AM teams running the GT going forward.

I think the Porsche just had much better aero package than everyone else. You could kind of see it when Bourdais and Makowiecki were battling, the Ford had so much more mid corner speed in Porsche curves and through Dunlop/Tetre Rouge, but it just didn't have the top end to match the RSR.
They were saying the reason the new Astons were so slow was because they were hitting an aero wall on Mulsane because they just didn't have enough time to test out the new car's aero at Le Mans.

I like how the Eurosport commentators called #92 "Peppa" Porsche. ;)
 

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Discussion Starter · #36 ·
Re: Le Mans 2018

Two hours to go...the pink pig is flying! :)

But I’m amazed at how close things are in LM GTE Pro...I haven’t watched sports car or endurance racing in like forever, is it normally this tight?


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Yes, the last few years have been very competitive in GTE Pro and Am. Last years Le Mans, GTE Pro came down to the last lap between Corvette and Aston.
Both the WEC (Europe) and IMSA (America) do a decent job of balancing the GTE cars out so they turn pretty similar lap times. Doesn't mean the teams don't complain in the press, but I think the results speak for themselves. It's pretty amazing considering how different all the cars are.

I think it's also part of the why they allow Porsche to move the engine to be in front of the rear axle. the GTE cars are pretty much purpose built race cars anyway, they know they need to keep all the manufacturers happy, so the ends justify the means. They are willing to fudge the car's specs in order to get better racing. They basically let Ford GT run roughshod over the rule book and dictate new "aero regulations" when they introduced the GT the first year. Prior to that, there were no crazy rear diffusers allowed in GTE, the cars looked much more like their street car counterparts.
But Ford wanted to start off with an advantage and they wanted a good chance to win right off the bat if they were going to spend all that money building the cars.

Which is also why I think it's funny when Bourdais was interviewed after his stint against Makowiecki and he complained on live TV about Balance of Performance rules. Like, they basically threw BOP out the window that first year Ford came back to let Ford sweep the podium. Kind of ironic that a Ford driver is complaining about BOP ... :hilarious:
 

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Re: Le Mans 2018

ALMS even back then was pretty buttoned up. My main takeaways were what a relatively close knit family the racing community was (and still may be to some degree). We had arguably the best hospitality of the teams in terms of food and atmosphere. We had our own Italian chef who also chef'd for Schumi many times during the season. Friday nights and Saturday nights were a who's who of drivers all joining for dinner because we had the best food and best atmosphere. It was not unusual to see McNish, Fellows, Biela, Dindo Capella, Papis and the like sitting at dinner. All were very friendly and we had great conversation. Actually got to be quite good friends with Max Papis (he drove our car for the longer endurance runs as 3rd driver). The other thing for me was how little fans probably know or appreciate how hard the crews work to prep cars and the brutal nature of pulling all nighters when a driver had an off track excursion. There were times when the 'boys' did not get any sleep at all......it was a great experience and one that I am so glad that I had the chance to have.
 

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Re: Le Mans 2018

ALMS even back then was pretty buttoned up. My main takeaways were what a relatively close knit family the racing community was (and still may be to some degree). We had arguably the best hospitality of the teams in terms of food and atmosphere. We had our own Italian chef who also chef'd for Schumi many times during the season. Friday nights and Saturday nights were a who's who of drivers all joining for dinner because we had the best food and best atmosphere. It was not unusual to see McNish, Fellows, Biela, Dindo Capella, Papis and the like sitting at dinner. All were very friendly and we had great conversation. Actually got to be quite good friends with Max Papis (he drove our car for the longer endurance runs as 3rd driver). The other thing for me was how little fans probably know or appreciate how hard the crews work to prep cars and the brutal nature of pulling all nighters when a driver had an off track excursion. There were times when the 'boys' did not get any sleep at all......it was a great experience and one that I am so glad that I had the chance to have.
That’s pretty awesome.

Thanks for sharing a glimpse into a world some of us only dream about.


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Re: Le Mans 2018

It turns out that the AMERICAN Corvette team was not so much “out of it” as we thought. After a rules violation was discovered post race, the #67 Ford GT was pushed back to 12th instead of 4th which put the #63 Corvette in 4th in GTE PRO. Not bad for an “old school” front engine car brand that actually runs the LeMans 24 as a front engine car. It appears that they won’t run a mid engine car until they actually build a production mid engine car. AMERICA’S CORVETTE ain’t dead yet.
 
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