[HassaanAbdeen]

Talk about freaks... I can't make any sense of this!

Mid-Engine Porsche 911 Race Car - 2017 Porsche 911 RSR Rear End

A friend of mine had a deposit on this since March while I have been making jokes on him that there's no such thing. Now here it is in the link above and I fail to make any sense from it.

Can anybody explain?

 

[chows4us]

This is the WEC car for 2017. Its a 991RSR. They moved the engine a bit forward. Thats all.

Still waiting on the FeFi so they got to have something

What do you mean he has deposit? Its a $600K or so racecar used by teams. Its not street legal.

 

[HassaanAbdeen]

What do you mean he has deposit? Its a $600K or so racecar used by teams. Its not street legal.

I kept telling him the RSR is not street legal but ever since the 911R frenzy the dealer here is taking deposits (30k USD per allocation) for any model you can fictionally create. 911 GTR, 911 GT5... etc. And there are guys rich enough and fool enough to keep putting deposits up to 20 names on a waiting list for Porsche 911 models not even in Fantasy Land.

600k is not an issue for him, but not being a street legal is a deal breaker... he won't believe me till the dealer refunds his deposit after making use of it for a year or two.

 

[chows4us]

I kept telling him the RSR is not street legal but ever since the 911R frenzy the dealer here is taking deposits (30k USD per allocation) for any model you can fictionally create. 911 GTR, 911 GT5... etc. And there are guys rich enough and fool enough to keep putting deposits up to 20 names on a waiting list for Porsche 911 models not even in Fantasy Land.

600k is not an issue for him, but not being a street legal is a deal breaker... he won't believe me till the dealer refunds his deposit after making use of it for a year or two.

ROFL. See Porsche Unveils 2017 GTE Contender - Sportscar365


This is a GTE class car.... like Manthey or McDreamy races at Le Mans. Its a 991RSR ... That last (R) = RACING

 

[ocgarza]

ROFL. See Porsche Unveils 2017 GTE Contender - Sportscar365


This is a GTE class car.... like Manthey or McDreamy races at Le Mans. Its a 991RSR ... That last (R) = RACING

Makes sense. Porsche needs another racing class to dominate and to jump start the street legal version which will be sold at dealers

 

[chows4us]

Makes sense. Porsche needs another racing class to dominate and to jump start the street legal version which will be sold at dealers

The street legal version, sort of, is the 991GT3RS. I don't know what the homogulation car is for the 991RSR. For the previous seasons, it was the 991S because the GT3 wasn't available yet, per Wiki.

Unfortunately, they are hardly dominating GTE. They need the FeFi but it appears the VW Scandal has about killed everything. This is another stop gap measure. They weren't event supposed to race in 2016. Diesels ... meh

 

[Rickyb]

That video is over the top sick! Listen to the software rev match the downshifts on the white one about 1:15 min into the video. Sick!

 

[Rickyb]

'This is the WEC car for 2017. Its a 991RSR. They moved the engine a bit forward. Thats all."

I'm curious, at what point does a car become truely mid-Engine? Is it a matter of what direction the drive shaft leaving the engine points, front or rear?

 

[chows4us]

'This is the WEC car for 2017. Its a 991RSR. They moved the engine a bit forward. Thats all."

I'm curious, at what point does a car become truely mid-Engine? Is it a matter of what direction the drive shaft leaving the engine points, front or rear?

Dunno. They 991 engine is moved forward from the 997. Its creepinggggg ....

 

[drPhilGandini]

The drive shafts on the 991 certainly point backwards, so at some point there must be a limit to the angle.
I 981 has the engine in front of the drive shafts, while a 991 has it behind. I think that's what defines a mid-engine car.
My understanding is that Porsche will build a mid-engine RSR and ask for an exemption from FIA and ACO to race a car that is based on a production car but not in production. Ford did this, and more, with the GT, since none had been produced before they won LM...

 

[formisano]

This is the WEC car for 2017. Its a 991RSR. They moved the engine a bit forward. Thats all.

Completely incorrect.
The RSR that is testing here (and for which they're requesting an exemption from the homologation rules) has the transaxle BEHIND the engine, as opposed to every other 911 that predates it.

This is not a matter of moving the engine "a bit forward". It's a completely different layout.

 

[formisano]

drPhil has it right, the layout of this RSR would be similar to the 981.

 

[chows4us]

The 991 engine is moved forward from the 997. If this is before the front axle, its still forward, but more than a bit. I didn't read that far. So its mid-engined. So much for the FeFi.

I guess the 911 will remain in production forever killing forever any idea of any Cayman ever racing with the big boys then. Or as they suggest, they will rename 960 or whatever and just charge more.

 

[formisano]

They moved the engine a bit forward. Thats all.

Chow,
I was taking issue with where you were saying, "Thats all".

It's actually a very big deal. It's not ONLY moving the engine forward a few inches. It is SWAPPING THE POSITION OF THE ENGINE AND THE TRANSMISSION IN A 911. Holy sh!t, a big deal, yes.

 

[chows4us]

Chow,
I was taking issue with where you were saying, "Thats all".

It's actually a very big deal. It's not ONLY moving the engine forward a few inches. It is SWAPPING THE POSITION OF THE ENGINE AND THE TRANSMISSION IN A 911. Holy sh!t, a big deal, yes.

You were right. I didn't read the entire article Porsche has kept the car's details quiet, and declined requests to discuss even the most basic aspects of transitioning from decades of rear-engine 911 designs to the new mid-engine-style installation.

Now Hassaan's friend's comment makes sense. This could be the FeFi but launched the Opposite way its normally done.

The 991RSR was homogulated from the 991S because the 991GT3 was not ready. I know they asked for a waiver. I know they were building a 960/988 and its probably been effectively killed by the VW Scandal. This might be their way to move toward a FeFi but instead of going with the production car first, build some race cars and THEN have them hit the street. If they do, well the Cayman will never race with the big boys and maybe they change the name of this car in production form to something else or maybe the 911 just evolves.

Its all good.

 

[fast1]

The drive shafts on the 991 certainly point backwards, so at some point there must be a limit to the angle.
I 981 has the engine in front of the drive shafts, while a 991 has it behind. I think that's what defines a mid-engine car.
My understanding is that Porsche will build a mid-engine RSR and ask for an exemption from FIA and ACO to race a car that is based on a production car but not in production. Ford did this, and more, with the GT, since none had been produced before they won LM...

Absolutely correct. In a mid-engine car, the engine is located behind the driver and in front of the rear drive axles. Just wondering why Porsche wouldn't just use the existing mid-engine platform, rather than developing a new one, especially given the multi-billion dollar fine that was levied against VW.

 

[chows4us]

Absolutely correct. In a mid-engine car, the engine is located behind the driver and in front of the rear drive axles. Just wondering why Porsche wouldn't just use the existing mid-engine platform, rather than developing a new one, especially given the multi-billion dollar fine that was levied against VW.

Because its not a 911. You race with your money maker.


From a German car mag https://translate.google.com/transl...t/porsche-911-rsr-2017-731157.html&edit-text=

Porsche 911 RSR with rear-mid-engine concept

The technical exception permits the engineers not to place the transmission as before, but behind the engine. The block moves slightly towards the center, which has a positive effect on the balance. The Porsche 911 RSR would therefore not be a rear-engine engine anymore, but a so-called rear mid-engine vehicle.

Not sure this is a true mid engined car. "slightly" forward. Rear mid-engined. Sounds like a kludgy name.

 

[drPhilGandini]

... Rear mid-engined. Sounds like a kludgy name.

Exactly! As I said before, the real issue is the angle the drive shafts make with the transmission and the wheels. There's only so much "wiggle room" there before joints go wonky. I recall the 991 has it's engine about 3" further forward than the 997.2, which was a big deal. At some point, whether the transmission is in front of the engine and the driveshafts orient backwards, or the engine is in front of the transmission and the driveshafts orient forwards, the car is going to become a mid-engined car! I imagine the "rear mid-engined" terminology is being used to make the exemption more palatable to the organizations that will award it. They want to see Porsche racing at Le Mans, Spa, Silverstone, COTA, etc...

 

[Rickyb]

In my opinion, Porsche will have to separate this new layout from the 911's, least the hordes storm the Stuttgart castle with pitchforks and torches!

 

[chows4us]

In my opinion, Porsche will have to separate this new layout from the 911's, least the hordes storm the Stuttgart castle with pitchforks and torches!

Like I said, possible. If there is as street production version, the can call it the FeFi and charge $300K.