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2nd Video I see some puffs of oil smoke, welcome to the club Mooty. I have to believe that's a modifed M3 to be hanging with you like that. You need more power my friend, come to the dark side, join me and we will make your Cayman more powerful that you can possibly imagine... /fckeditor/editor/images/smiley/MWPX/wink_smile.gif
 

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I don't think that is oil smoke, itsmore likely amishift hitting the rev limiter....


dave
 

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Yeah, I've had people following me later tell me about puffs; it's always at the apex of a high G corner; no shifting involved. Plus, I don't think Mooty ever misses a shift :)
 

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<blockquote id="quote">quote:<hr id="quote" noshade="noshade" height="1" />
Is that an e36 M3 that's hanging all over mooty's arse? <hr id="quote" noshade="noshade" height="1" />









yes, that's fong's e36m3 lwt with 3.2L and other tasty bits. fong's quite a good driver and never fails to make me nervous and make mistakes. though i have made him do a few tank slappers in his gt3 when i was on his *** at button willow.


now if i can just lower my gearing.....
</blockquote>

Edited by - mooty on 08/20/2006 11:19:08 PM
 

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<blockquote id="quote">quote:<hr id="quote" noshade="noshade" height="1" />
Yeah, I've had people following me later tell me about puffs; it's always at the apex of a high G corner; no shifting involved. Plus, I don't think Mooty ever misses a shift :) <hr id="quote" noshade="noshade" height="1" />






i have a button on the dash that deploys smoke to scare tailgaters. if it wasn't fong following me, i would have deployed my 'dump oil' button.


i dont think i missed a shift last friday at TH. most m96 based motors will puff smoke at high G loads and also at start up if you drove it hard.
</blockquote>

Edited by - mooty on 08/20/2006 11:17:56 PM
 

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Discussion Starter #8
yes, that's fong's e36m3 lwt with 3.2L and other tasty bits. fong's quite a good driver and never fails to make me nervous and make mistakes. though i have made him do a few tank slappers in his gt3 when i was on his *** at button willow.Edited by - mooty on 08/20/2006 11:19:08 PM
tankslappers? haha, I though that was the natural instincts of the GT3, to twist and roll

:)
 

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I was thinking of crafting a letter to PCNA, Porsche AG and Wolfgang Porsche personally and letting them know about this problem and asking them if they can/will fix it. There must be some reason why oil is getting back up into the intake system of the motor and then getting ingested and spewed out the back. Mooty's oil puffs were much much smaller than my clouds of oil smoke when an ingestion event happened. At least by writing the letter if it comes down to Porsche claiming they never knew of the problem they won't be able to, they might also be nice and put an engineer on the problem and find a fix!
 

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I heard today from a Porsche technician that there is some kind of recent bulletin and fix for 996 engines to do with oil smoke. I am not sure of all the details, but perhaps the Cayman has similar issues?
 

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If there is I haven't seen it.... and its not listed with renntech or any other data servive I've seen.


I did have a simiar problem w/ my 996 TT though...the solution was to keep the oil level at about midway between the high and low mark on the level indicator. all the blowby stopped then... it all began when the dealer overfilled it one day....


dw
 

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i understand that if you reduce oil level a bit, less blow by.


but will that induce more likelihood of oil starvation? i dont really know.


when i tracked a e36m3, i was told to add 1/2 quart more oil than full.
 

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Blow by on a horizontal engine under a high corner G load is probably due to the rings not-seated perfectly or micro-scratches in the liner...and under load that is parallel to the cylinder makes for an easy pass by for the oil.


Lowering the amount of oil in the car would do nothing to resolve this (and I'm of course just speculating on cause) issue. Long term, oil inside the cylinder as well as inside the exhaust will create (potentially) a slew of other issues that may or may not impact the car (cats, exhaust valve wear, cylinder liner wear, carbon build up and loss of performance, etc).


Just my take.


Paul
 

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its not blowby getting past the rings, its oil getting into the intake and then sucked into the combustion chamber. search rennlist or 6speed 996TT forums and you will find more info on the problem then you will ever need....


the baffled pan won't fix this but will let you run without starvation issues oncorners....


ading and extra quart only causes foaming and drag on thecrank...the M3's have issues with the pumps breaking under track stress its not a starvation issue.


dw
 

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DaveW,


If this problem has been known for awhile and discussed on other sites previously, why hasn't Porsche done anything about it? I heard from Mantis and they are working on a fix but no details on what it will involve just yet. How far back does this problem go? Back to 1999?
 

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I had the smoke-on-startup 3 or 4 times at Reno-Fernley last weekend, though none reported on track. The first time it happened, there was substantial concern from the assembled PCA instructors & grid crew and they didn't want to let me out onto the track until I assured them it was a 'known' foible and they saw the smoking was clearly temporary.



I did get a huge puff exiting turn 13 at ButtonWillow back in June and that troubled the engine sensors enough to throw the ECU into limp mode and it wouldn't rev past 6K, so I think this issue can have track-day ruining consequences.



FYI, I was running 2 segments below full when these startup puffs were occurring, so I don't think running with lower oil levels fixes it.
 

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Here is what Stan from Mantis Racing sent me on this:


The official Porsche line is that this series of engines are not racing engines...their racing engine is the 964/993 block GT3 engine which is also used in the turbo models. The PCV breathers are ingesting oil into the intake to meet emmissions standards I think, so every once-in-a-while you will be driving a two stroke engine. (High G right handers after hard braking)



Ernie is playing with this to see if he can route the occasional oil that is picked-up by the PCV intake and re-route this to a catch tank and then the oil cooler and back into service.



I don't know why we don't see this more in 996's, the Cayman S may have a different pick-up point.



We will keep you posted, testing some things at Targa in two weeks.
 

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i understand that if you reduce oil level a bit, less blow by.


but will that induce more likelihood of oil starvation? i dont really know.


when i tracked a e36m3, i was told to add 1/2 quart more oil than full.

My experience is that adding oil makes it worse. Running with less oil I got some intermitent CEL in the apex of high g corners; it flashed so quickly that I could not see what it was complaining about, but I:m guessing oil starvation.


Seems you can just live with it and keep the oil at the proper full level; or get the fix from Mantis. It some sort of baffle to keep the oil from going into the intake.
 
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