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I recently purchased a pre-owned 2009 Cayman S with PDK from a Porsche dealer in another market. It was a Porsche Company car that had never been titled with 8,500 miles. The dealer assured me repeatedly that it had not been used as a PDK demo car (you know, the ones many of us got to drive hard at the track and demo the launch control ect...). They told me it was their service reps car that was used as a daily driver for 6 months. I took it to my home dealer for a PCM recall and asked them to run diagnostics to see how the engine tested. They told me that in the codes, source 1 showed 2666 red line shifts and 187.5 Hrs. I called the dealer in the other market (pretty miffed) and was told that isn't what the 2666 means and I shouldn't be concerned. Can anyone shed some light on the subject? Does this mean my "new" car has 8500 really hard miles or as the dealer where I purchased it said "some cars come from the factory with similar readings". Is that true?!! PLEASE HELP!!!

:helpme:
 

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3 different Porsche Dealers have givien me 3 different answers (You would think I was talking to Attorneys!). One said it is the number of red line shifts, another said it was the number of times it hit the red line and the other said it was the number of cycles at red line. There apparently is no way to find out how many times the launch control was used.
 

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I'd pass on the car. My dealer showed off the PDK launch control on a brand new car with no warm up, in March, early morning. They do this all the time. The car had 8 miles on it. I can only assume that I wasn't the only customer that got the launch demo.

There is no way I would buy that car (IMHO).
 

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OMG, so much BS. Here is what that means - 2,660 ignitions at over rev 1 with the last one at 187.5 operating hour. (Only last operating hour logged, but all over rev ignitions) I assume that on teh 09s that is 7,700 RPM, it is 7,400 RPM on gen 1. at 7,700 RPM the car revved for about 15 seconds total in its live at that range. I would guess 15 visits to redline. If there are none at overev 3+ then do not worry about over revs. There is nothing in the ECU that would tell you if the car was revved hard cold. Which is unfortunate.

Check tires. How many miles again? Original or brand new tires? That will tell you much more than the ECU readout.

Tomasz
 

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OMG, so much BS. Here is what that means - 2,660 ignitions at over rev 1 with the last one at 187.5 operating hour. (Only last operating hour logged, but all over rev ignitions) I assume that on teh 09s that is 7,700 RPM, it is 7,400 RPM on gen 1. at 7,700 RPM the car revved for about 15 seconds total in its live at that range. I would guess 15 visits to redline. If there are none at overev 3+ then do not worry about over revs. There is nothing in the ECU that would tell you if the car was revved hard cold. Which is unfortunate. Tomasz
Good interpretation. Only one thing to add, some cars do come from the factory with non-zero ignition counts in the over-rev ranges, but those are in the single digits, not 2600+. I can't believe the bs stories dealers sometimes tell. Some cars might indeed be over-revved when they come off the boat or are put on trucks, but that's a different scenario altogether, and it won't be PDK cars.

To the OP: I think your expectations are a bit unreasonable that a car with 8500 miles is somehow "new". Also, taking an engine to redline now and then is not necessarily bad for it, especially in PDK cars that can't miss a shift. I'd much rather have an engine wound up a lot, than one that has been lugged around in city traffic. As for launch control use, any time you're buying a car that has been on dealer's lot for any period of time you might have launch control "tested". If you want a "virgin" you'll have to order a car and make sure the dealer knows your expectations about test drives. (A BMW dealer once tried to take me for a test drive in a customer-ordered car that just came in. I refused, and told them I'd never buy a car from a dealer so untrustworthy, and left.)
 

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OMG, so much BS. Here is what that means - 2,660 ignitions at over rev 1 with the last one at 187.5 operating hour. (Only last operating hour logged, but all over rev ignitions) I assume that on teh 09s that is 7,700 RPM, it is 7,400 RPM on gen 1. at 7,700 RPM the car revved for about 15 seconds total in its live at that range. I would guess 15 visits to redline. If there are none at overev 3+ then do not worry about over revs. There is nothing in the ECU that would tell you if the car was revved hard cold. Which is unfortunate.

Check tires. How many miles again? Original or brand new tires? That will tell you much more than the ECU readout.

Tomasz
+1. Yes, "so much BS." I wouldn't be worried at all by those readings.
 

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I was talking about redlining the car with a cold engine. In my case the dealer grabbed the demo with PDK and showed me the launch control function 1 min. after start-up. I'm pretty sure that's not a good idea, especially when this is done on a regular basis. But obviously, in this case there is no way knowing....
 

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I would be surprised to find any Porsche with 8500 miles, that didn't have some ignitions in Rev range 1 (i.e. redline), but I suppose it could happen.

The real concern about over-revs is in MT cars, where a forced downshift at high speed can spool the engine way past the redline - this should never happen in a PDK or Tiptronic.
 

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I'd pass on the car. My dealer showed off the PDK launch control on a brand new car with no warm up, in March, early morning. They do this all the time. The car had 8 miles on it. I can only assume that I wasn't the only customer that got the launch demo.

There is no way I would buy that car (IMHO).
:hilarious: The official Porsche Cayman promo video shows launch Control with the water temp dial at only a quarter which equates approx 2 minutes start time. :crazy: fools at least show some respect when promoting your cars.
 

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This is nothing to worry about, really. The PDK, when used in sport + automatic mode, will ONLY shift at red-line. I also agree that you shouldn't expect to have a "new" car with more than 8k miles on it. The car is probably nicely broken in... and was driven the way Porsches should be driven... but, I seriously doubt it has been abused. It's your $$ and you'll have to decide.

brad
 

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I've been shifting Porsches at or near redline since 1974, haven't had an issue yet....
 

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I was talking about redlining the car with a cold engine. In my case the dealer grabbed the demo with PDK and showed me the launch control function 1 min. after start-up. I'm pretty sure that's not a good idea, especially when this is done on a regular basis. But obviously, in this case there is no way knowing....
I agreed with you. And should have been clear, the BS comment was about what the dealers were saying. I know that the ECU counts cold starts, or at least that is what the numbers seems to indicate. I wish it kept track of cold high revs as well.
 

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Discussion Starter #15
FYI...It was the dealer that kept referring to the car as new, because it had never been titled. That is why I put it in quotes on my original post. I was under no illusions that it was a used car that had an in service date of last March.
 

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In my view, the most important thing -since you indicated you've already purchased the car- is that you have the Porsche manufacturer's warranty to rely on.

The dealer won't be taking the car back, even if in hindsight it does not meet your expectations, so I'd say don't worry knowing you have the warranty.

And as to the dealer assurances, I'd say if they aren't written into your purchase contract they aren't worth much.

Bottom line; relax and enjoy the ride! Congratulations!
 

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For what it is worth. I have driven my '09 C2s with PDK for almost a year with no issues (it has never seen red line though but close and only when warm) HOWEVER I have also been to two PSDS and driven PDK cars on the track HARD! I have asked them about PDK problems since they have had PDK cars for a year and the answer NO PROBLEMS. that said I have a PDK base Cayman coming as a track car and it does have Sport Chrono. If anyone wants to know how many times I will use launch control the answer is a clear ZERO Foolish abuse of a great engine and transmission, but it will be pushed at autocross and track events. Now to your issue, the car has warranty, enjoy it, don't you push it hard until you get oil temp ... and enjoy Porsche builds great cars and they want to be run hard. A great example is my '83 SC which has over 130,000 miles on the car and engine, many hard track miles and the engine still produces factory hp and in the last leak down test measured over 97 %. REPEAT: Porsche builds great cars that want to and need to be driven hard .... but only warm, everybody needs a disclaimer
 

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If anyone wants to know how many times I will use launch control the answer is a clear ZERO Foolish abuse of a great engine and transmission
Not sure how using Launch Control is foolish abuse......It is all within the cars capabilities and as it controls every aspect of a luanch and has been tested there is no reason why you wouldn't use it.

To the OP I would have no worries with the car especially as it has PDK and cannot miss a shift or overrev in the way a manual can.....just get out there and drive :cheers:
 

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Not sure how using Launch Control is foolish abuse......It is all within the cars capabilities and as it controls every aspect of a luanch and has been tested there is no reason why you wouldn't use it.

To the OP I would have no worries with the car especially as it has PDK and cannot miss a shift or overrev in the way a manual can.....just get out there and drive :cheers:
Let me put my comment about launch control in perspective. I have never been a fan of drag racing, most autocrosses have a turn shortly after the start to influence folks not to stomp on the throttle at the start. Lastly most DE's do not includse at standing start so for me my comment is valid and while having been tested by Porsche I still do not want to put that stress om my power-train .
 

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Not sure how using Launch Control is foolish abuse......It is all within the cars capabilities and as it controls every aspect of a luanch and has been tested there is no reason why you wouldn't use it. . . .
Unless, of course, you are talking about a Nissan GTR, where using the LC can both damage your tranny and void your warranty. :rolleyes:
 
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