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Discussion Starter #21
You may be right. If the release date is the date the car can be sold, then maybe orders can be placed before then???? Makes only a small difference for me. Since I live in the Northeast, I wouldn't be looking to take delivery until mid-spring next year anyway.
As nice as it can be here early in the year, sport car driving season really doesn't get underway where I live until March/April anyway, especially when the car will come with Michelin Cup 2 tires!
 

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Got some news from my dealership today. Release date in the US will be Feb 15th. First allocations are going to west coast dealers. Still not sure exactly what "release date" means??? My dealer is in the Boston area and has no allocations yet, although they are a very large and prominent dealer network so they will likely get some of the first slots.
Sorry, a little confused here... are you referring to the new GTS or the GT4?

The topic title mentions the GT4 but much of the conversation is around what the new GTS will be :)
 

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Sorry, a little confused here... are you referring to the new GTS or the GT4?

The topic title mentions the GT4 but much of the conversation is around what the new GTS will be :)
I am referring to the GT4 and Spyder. Haven't heard anything about the GTS, if there are any major changes.
 

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Sorry, a little confused here... are you referring to the new GTS or the GT4?

The topic title mentions the GT4 but much of the conversation is around what the new GTS will be :)
Basically, just baseless speculation about how the GT4 will impact the rest of the 718 line. It’s all guesswork- NA 6 in GTS? Who knows?


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Porsche took a lot of flack for the new engine not rev'ing as quickly as the old one so the ECU tune was updated but this update had to go through certifications. The good news is that the update was approved (usually are rubber stamped from what I'm told) and now the engine "should" rev faster and produce a little more power to boot. Evidently, Porsche did not want a side-by-side video of the tach in a 981 GT4 and 718 GT4 on YouTube showing the difference and that was about to happen. So rejoice, you should be getting a better car thanks to early tester complaints and a clever person with a video. :)
 

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Discussion Starter #26
Porsche took a lot of flack for the new engine not rev'ing as quickly as the old one so the ECU tune was updated but this update had to go through certifications. The good news is that the update was approved (usually are rubber stamped from what I'm told) and now the engine "should" rev faster and produce a little more power to boot. Evidently, Porsche did not want a side-by-side video of the tach in a 981 GT4 and 718 GT4 on YouTube showing the difference and that was about to happen. So rejoice, you should be getting a better car thanks to early tester complaints and a clever person with a video. :)
Really!? Thanks for this update K-Man, I recall you mentioned that 4.0l was rumoured to be a slower rev'ing engine, was this 'fix' shared by the same source?
 

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I have never known Porsche to give you more for less. A flat six for the price of a four?

I’m still kind of cynical about the change. I thought that Porsche said the current Cayman/Boxster would remain until 2023? Additionally, there would then be two different 982’s? Just odd. Hopefully we will know soon.


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There’s already 2 982s, the minute they announced the 718 GT4/Spyder.

I feel like they’ve painted themselves in a corner with the 718. Bugs the hell out of me.


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Discussion Starter #28
There’s already 2 982s, the minute they announced the 718 GT4/Spyder.

I feel like they’ve painted themselves in a corner with the 718. Bugs the hell out of me.


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Not sure I understand, by '2' you mean T4 and NA6? What corner?

Maybe then I will know why it bugs you so...
 

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Not sure I understand, by '2' you mean T4 and NA6? What corner?

Maybe then I will know why it bugs you so...
Yes the GT4 NA6 and the rest with the T4, all 718s. The corner being the “story” for the whole 718 angle. They’re trying to have it both ways and with their M.O. of tying a model to their history, they just can’t do that in my book. It just bugs the hell out of me and kind of makes them lose a little bit of credibility in my eyes. Like they had a bit of a lapse and we’ve seen behind the curtain.

Even when they put a 4 in the 912, it was the 912 not a 911 with a 4.

It’s just a personal thing I guess. It just really bugs me. It feels a little disingenuous or like playing customers.


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There’s already 2 982s, the minute they announced the 718 GT4/Spyder.

I feel like they’ve painted themselves in a corner with the 718. Bugs the hell out of me.


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But not with the same designation. If the NA6 went into the GTS, there would be two 982 GTS models with the same designation but different engines. It doesn’t seem likely to me but what do I know.


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But not with the same designation. If the NA6 went into the GTS, there would be two 982 GTS models with the same designation but different engines. It doesn’t seem likely to me but what do I know.


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They’re already doing that with the GT4/Spyder and every other 718. The 981,982 etc are just internal numbers and until the 718, the Cayman/Boxster where not known per se with a number. In this case, all the 718 are 982 but 982 isn’t really used to describe it. Both lines are “718”. Regardless, the two I’m talking about are the NA6 718 vs the T4 718. Both 718 with different engines.


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My car was supposed to leave the day factory end of Oct, but it’s still in production as of today, so I guess it’s been delayed again by a few weeks.
 

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I would have much preferred just continuing to call the two 982 cars the Cayman and the Boxster like previous iterations (such as my 981) and forget the 718 name all together.
 

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They’re already doing that with the GT4/Spyder and every other 718. The 981,982 etc are just internal numbers and until the 718, the Cayman/Boxster where not known per se with a number. In this case, all the 718 are 982 but 982 isn’t really used to describe it. Both lines are “718”. Regardless, the two I’m talking about are the NA6 718 vs the T4 718. Both 718 with different engines.


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Okay, but how is this really different from the "normal" turbocharged 911 motors vs the NA GT3?
 

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Discussion Starter #35
My car was supposed to leave the day factory end of Oct, but it’s still in production as of today, so I guess it’s been delayed again by a few weeks.
I am sure that is disappointing news for you, but if K-Mans's post #25 about a change to the ECU programing to enable a faster revving engine, best it get taken care of before it ships!

Thanks for the update!
 

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Okay, but how is this really different from the "normal" turbocharged 911 motors vs the NA GT3?
Well, both cars are 6s and always had been. The fact that one is turbo and one is not, turbo/GT3, is the M.O. for that model line. Now that they've added turbos to all of them is a bit of a conundrum but still not as bad as marketing based on a historical model, they're still 911s with flat 6s. Mixing an engine configuration that was never offered on that historical model and marketing that new model with the same lineage is just silly and presumes the customer is too stupid to notice. But, I've also said they have started a new trend with the Taycan. Naming EVs with monikers from ICE cars. It's not a turbocharged model and obviously not even an ICE model, but yet they choose to keep the turbo names. I get it, they're known for those models being the pinnacle and dropping them at this point might risk losing the cache, but they could have started a new EV naming convention and began building new cache for the up coming EV future. Now they are stuck and any deviation in the future to try to be more EV will again seem confusing. But ok, I kinda get the reasoning for doing so. But coming out with the 718, they were 110% in the historical marketing mode until they had an "oh sh!t" moment when it was not going as well as they thought, possibly. So instead of doubling back and bringing back the 6 (of course something they would never have done as that would be admitting they were wrong) or just sticking to the marketing hype 110% with the T4, they bring out a GT4 NA6 but keep up the 718 charade. I'm not privy to inside decisions of course but it's just a bit of a strange and confusing one. We've never heard a good reason for the switch to the T4, aside from conjecture and flinging ideas all over the internet, no one knows why they did it. They could have just as easily left it as is, bumped up the HP/TQ in increments as usual until 2021/23(or whenever) when it's rumored to go EV. It's not significant enough of a model in the VW group to help corporate emission averages THAT much and there's debate whether it actually is less emissions to begin with.
 

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Discussion Starter #37
Well, both cars are 6s and always had been. The fact that one is turbo and one is not, turbo/GT3, is the M.O. for that model line. Now that they've added turbos to all of them is a bit of a conundrum but still not as bad as marketing based on a historical model, they're still 911s with flat 6s. Mixing an engine configuration that was never offered on that historical model and marketing that new model with the same lineage is just silly and presumes the customer is too stupid to notice. But, I've also said they have started a new trend with the Taycan. Naming EVs with monikers from ICE cars. It's not a turbocharged model and obviously not even an ICE model, but yet they choose to keep the turbo names. I get it, they're known for those models being the pinnacle and dropping them at this point might risk losing the cache, but they could have started a new EV naming convention and began building new cache for the up coming EV future. Now they are stuck and any deviation in the future to try to be more EV will again seem confusing. But ok, I kinda get the reasoning for doing so. But coming out with the 718, they were 110% in the historical marketing mode until they had an "oh sh!t" moment when it was not going as well as they thought, possibly. So instead of doubling back and bringing back the 6 (of course something they would never have done as that would be admitting they were wrong) or just sticking to the marketing hype 110% with the T4, they bring out a GT4 NA6 but keep up the 718 charade. I'm not privy to inside decisions of course but it's just a bit of a strange and confusing one. We've never heard a good reason for the switch to the T4, aside from conjecture and flinging ideas all over the internet, no one knows why they did it. They could have just as easily left it as is, bumped up the HP/TQ in increments as usual until 2021/23(or whenever) when it's rumored to go EV. It's not significant enough of a model in the VW group to help corporate emission averages THAT much and there's debate whether it actually is less emissions to begin with.
Ahhhh, I got your points, yes a strange marketing strategy this whole DNA thing, makes me laugh really, drawing lineage back to an object that clearly has no
Deoxyribonucleic acid, a double helix carrying genetic instructions for the development... ;)

To me their naming convention has always been a head scratcher, a 911 can be a 911 or 964, 996, 997 then going back down for a bit to 991 an now climbing again. The Boxster then the Cayman have had a similar numbering scheme, then they decided to throw it back to a 718, the Kool-Aid is strong in Germany...

I simply ignore all of this, these are the mid-engine Boxster/Cayman models which have come with a few different engines sizes and configurations over their life and possibly in the future hybrid or pure EV, different power plants for different markets and times

I buy the one I want and enjoy it without a care in the world for the number they choose this round!
 

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I buy the one I want and enjoy it without a care in the world for the number they choose this round!
I agree. I do the same, but it seems to be lately a situation with the marketing I can't not be perturbed. It made sense for a while in the 80s-90s, but now it's like they've taken the strategy too far and they look silly. Almost to the point of thinking, 'these customers are so stupid they'll buy anything we say is tied to our legacy.' I think of a young kid getting a few laughs at his antics then becomes almost annoying trying to get more laughs with the same antics, "hey watch what I can do! Yeah yeah kid, it was funny the first 500 times."

And don't even get me started with rear bumper nameplates as of late. :rolleyes:
 

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I agree. I do the same, but it seems to be lately a situation with the marketing I can't not be perturbed. It made sense for a while in the 80s-90s, but now it's like they've taken the strategy too far and they look silly. Almost to the point of thinking, 'these customers are so stupid they'll buy anything we say is tied to our legacy.' I think of a young kid getting a few laughs at his antics then becomes almost annoying trying to get more laughs with the same antics, "hey watch what I can do! Yeah yeah kid, it was funny the first 500 times."

And don't even get me started with rear bumper nameplates as of late. :rolleyes:
The Taycan Turbo makes about as much sense as the Turbo Lasers on the Death Star in Star Wars
 

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I agree. I do the same, but it seems to be lately a situation with the marketing I can't not be perturbed. It made sense for a while in the 80s-90s, but now it's like they've taken the strategy too far and they look silly. Almost to the point of thinking, 'these customers are so stupid they'll buy anything we say is tied to our legacy.' I think of a young kid getting a few laughs at his antics then becomes almost annoying trying to get more laughs with the same antics, "hey watch what I can do! Yeah yeah kid, it was funny the first 500 times."

And don't even get me started with rear bumper nameplates as of late. :rolleyes:
I completely agree.

For the possible turbo 4-less 718 Cayman GTS, turbo 4-less 718 GT4 and, especially so for Taycan Turbo S, the solution is simple. Act with extreme prejudice and debadge the poor thing.

Any "engineering/technical" company which built their success on engineering without peers that succumbs to marketing will not last very long. I do not need Wharton degree to say that. It is like an axiom - a self-evident truth. ;)

Finally, back to topic (kinda-sorta) ... If Porsche wants to push me to the limits of insanely irresponsible fiscal behavior, they will release NA flat 6 Cayman GTS. The only problem is that I still am very much in love with my current car. So, Porsche, it better be REALLY good. :)
 
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