Late to the party again I see.

:hilarious:


Nudge, nudge, hint, hint

 

Late to the party again I see.

Nah. That's specifically asking about a Cayman R. This is about a new powertrain altogether. It's more likely a 981.2 rather than necessarily an R/Spyder variant.

Of course, I may be wrong. We'll find out in 50 pages of speculation or so...

 

Before the 981C was even launched, it was rumored that Porsche would (at some point in the near future) drop the flat-6 in 981 and replace it with a turbo-4. And for the same reason most German auto mfrs have switched to smaller engines with turbos - fuel efficiency.

PS: I found the article
http://www.motorauthority.com/news/...080815_porsche-to-debut-4-cylinder-cayman-turbo-at-the-2013-frankfurt-auto-show

 

Before the 981 was even launched, it was rumored that Porsche would (at some point in the near future) drop the flat-6 in 981 and replace it with a turbo-4. And for the same reason most German auto mfrs have switched to smaller engines with turbos - fuel efficiency.

Its actually more than that; emissions play a big role as well here.

Would this be for the next 9xx or 981.2?????

Thats what the rumor mill says.

 

Would this be for the next 9xx or 981.2?????

 

It was only a matter of time. All automakers are turning into smaller FI engines due to emissions, efficiency (better CAFE), and cost. To me, an auto transmission OR FI engine (both even more so) is a deal-breaker on a sports car. But I'm fully aware both NA engines and manual trannies are becoming extinct, hence the decision to buy my first and only Porsche now, since I consider the Cayman S (or GTS) the best driving car in the world. And yes, I'm obviously not into big HP, but the driving pleasure. BMW doesn't make a NA engine now, and that's soon going to be the norm. And auto transmissions are already deep into the 90 percentile. Sad times, but our kids won't even know what they were missing.

 

It's on Road and Track too. GOD I hate Turbo Lag. My BMW has the Turbo 4 and it's putt putt.......zoom....

Four-Cylinder Power for Boxster and Cayman - News - Road & Track

 

Let the speculation begin...

From R&T

"casually mentioning 400 PS (395 hp) as a theoretical peak. Naturally, you can expect boost and timing to be tweaked so that the mid-engined Porsche doesn't overlap the 911's performance figures."

"Theoretical Peak" does not mean you will see it from the factory on day 1, or day 1000. Don't they trickle HP updates out slowly over the years?

 

From R&T

"casually mentioning 400 PS (395 hp) as a theoretical peak. Naturally, you can expect boost and timing to be tweaked so that the mid-engined Porsche doesn't overlap the 911's performance figures."

PS: Following is for WW; it isn't a comment, one way or the other, about chows4us' post.

Read my lips: " P will NEVER, EVER let the 981 get close to the HP ratings of the 911." The 911 is a cash cow, to say nothing about it's status as a sacred icon. The 981 already out-handles the 911; as acknowledged by every major auto mag. Giving the 981 as much power as the 911 would cannibalize 911 sales, and P ain't gonna let that happen. Don't even bother dreaming about it. If you want more power, go aftermarket or see Ruf.

 

Porsche won't let the Cayman/Boxster be outrageously faster than the 911 as long as it costs less. But all bets are off if they can find a reason to position it higher from a pricing standpoint. If they don't have any problem charging $75k for the Cayman GTS which is basically a freakin' bumper and smoked headlights, a Cayman Turbo with 375-400 hp for $90k+ is a definite possibility. In fact, they've already done this with the Panamera. The base Panamera starts around $78k, but you have to believe more than a few buyers cross-shopped a 911 and the Panamera S, which starts at $93k. And Porsche is okay with this because $93k is more than a base 911 costs.

 

Porsche won't let the Cayman/Boxster be outrageously faster than the 911 as long as it costs less. But all bets are off if they can find a reason to position it higher from a pricing standpoint. If they don't have any problem charging $75k for the Cayman GTS which is basically a freakin' bumper and smoked headlights, a Cayman Turbo with 375-400 hp for $90k+ is a definite possibility....

Pretty much. Since the Caymans handling already gets good press, adding more HP will come at a higher premium 4 banger or not. The price difference between future Cayman/Boxsters and 911's will narrow dramatically. Porsche benefits from Material/Production costs decrease - roll out of higher incremental power increases - at higher prices. The margins on the Boxster/Caymans start to look very attractive to Porsche.

 

Nothing to speculate here. There's a lot of easy power to get from forced induction. 170-190HP/liter is pretty common with turbochargers these days.

Weird knowing my just-ordered GTS will sort of be a piece of history, being one of the last naturally aspirated flat-sixes. It also makes me fairly more certain that we'll see the detuned 3.8L in the Spyder/R -- it will be the ultimate swan song for the naturally aspirated Boxster/Cayman, and one helluva send off.

NA BMW inline-6s are gone. Ridiculous NA Mercedes-Benz V8s are gone. The NA Porsche flat-6 is next. We're witnessing a sea change. We all know why it's happening and has to happen, but it still makes us sad.

 

Ok. I'll start it.

Next Porsche Boxster And Cayman Will Get Flat Four, Possibly 400 HP

"We had heard rumors of Porsche lopping two cylinders off the next generation Boxster and Cayman, but now Porsche head honcho Matthias Müller has confirmed the news. Oh, and he said they might have 400 horsepower. Whaaaaaaaaa?"

Let the speculation begin...

So Mr. Weasel, are you going to order a GTS, or, based on this post of yours, are you going to continue to wait for the highest hp variant and therefore never actually buy a car? :taunt:

 

So Mr. Weasel, are you going to order a GTS, or, based on this post of yours, are you going to continue to wait for the highest hp variant and therefore never actually buy a car? :taunt:

:hilarious: My plan is to order a car by Christmas and all indications are that it will be a GTS. IF it turns out that all the flat-6's are on the way out for the Boxster/Cayman platform, I think I'll be happy to have it too. I drive a turbo Mazdaspeed3 right now, and while I love the power it has, I do prefer the power delivery on my other supercharged car over the turbo. For spirited driving, it's not really relevant, but for every day boring driving it's more noticeable. If I'm having fun and pushing the car a bit, then the turbo is spooled up and all is well. But if I'm just puttering along in 4th or 5th and just decide to speed up a bit, that's where the lag is really noticeable. I really like the idea of having all the power available instantly.

It's also worth noting that I was never waiting for the GTS to buy. My plan has always been about hitting a savings goal and then spending it on a car. I set that goal long before there were whispers of a GTS and have been slowly plodding my way toward it ever since. All indications are that I'll get there near the end of this year, and that's when I intend to pull the trigger. I'm looking forward to this summer of figuring out exactly what to order, though I've probably figured most of that out already just from learning about all the options here.

 

here we go....395hp in the future........

4-cylinder for Porsche Cayman, Boxster will improve mpg, handling

 

Re: here we go....395hp in the future........

4-cylinder for Porsche Cayman, Boxster will improve mpg, handling

and decrease reliability and longivity to boot! Did the turbo thing on an Audi, couldn't wait to get back to NA.

 

Re: here we go....395hp in the future........

Don't care how many cylinders, that many ponies in a Boxster/Cayman is just ragazine bullsh!t.

 

Four cylinder Boxster/Cayman a reality!

Porsche finally moving ahead with flat four engine - Autoblog

 

Re: here we go....395hp in the future........

I much rather have the current engine than even a 500 flat 4, but to each his own. With that mentality, you'd never buy anything, because things will always keep changing . And lately, not for the better IMO. Electric power steering, no manual tranny in many cars, smaller turbo/SC engines, etc. And technology will continue to detract from the driving experience, with drive-by-wire brakes, steering, etc. Yes, power seems to keep increasing (there has to be a limit, and we might be reaching it already), but I don't care when done with force induction. To each his own though.

 

Re: here we go....395hp in the future........

I'm not a fan of moving from 6 cylinders, down to a 4 cylinder turbo. However, if they can incorporate the hybrid technology in the 918 to add more torque where you normally get turbo lag, that could be cool. Of course, the engine probably won't sound as good, but we might get similar, smooth performance while being better for the environment.

 

Ok. I'll start it.

Next Porsche Boxster And Cayman Will Get Flat Four, Possibly 400 HP

"We had heard rumors of Porsche lopping two cylinders off the next generation Boxster and Cayman, but now Porsche head honcho Matthias Müller has confirmed the news. Oh, and he said they might have 400 horsepower. Whaaaaaaaaa?"

Let the speculation begin...

This post from 6 months ago or so may have been pretty close to what is going to happen: http://www.planet-9.com/981-chat/87.../87129-981-owners-why-you-not-more-concerned-about-4cyl-turbo-4.html#post772104

 

Sure, but up until recently there's been nothing official from Porsche on the subject. Now they've apparently confirmed it and it's just a matter of time, hence the new thread.

 

Multiple threads merged. Please don't start another thread on the exact same subject.

 

Tremendous, deep and heartfelt apologies for creating a WHOLE new thread on this topic. I'm waiting for the anti-duplicate thread police to knock down my door! Hopefully my beheading will be quick and painless. And I dearly hope my thread doesn't crash Ken's server! That extra, not to mention immense, 5K of data could start those hard drives smoking!

Ya know, I get the whole why-create-a-new-thread-on-a-topic-that-is-already-being-discussed argument... makes perfect sense. But what irks me is the attitude some people take when it happens. Really? Is it that big of a deal?

I will take a self-imposed exhile from P9 for a few days as punishment. See ya when I get out of solitary...

 

LOL :hilarious:

Cheers

 

I remain skeptical.

Cheers

 

What would make sense to me is make the base Boxster and Caymans F4-turbo, and leave the other engines as they are. Porsche should continue using NA engines and manual transmissions IMO. But we'll know soon if both are in the cards. If turbos supplant NA, then the range-topping 'turbo' would obviously disappear. If only F-4s are turbo, the 911 turbo would mean 6-cyl turbo (just like the Panamera turbo refers to the V8), but if any other 6-cyl is turbocharged, then that'd be out the window.

Finally, I have to say the Subaru turbos I've heard (with the quad pipes, and some kind of sport exhaust) sound awesome and unique IMO. The F4-turbo is coming for sure; the only question is where it'd be used. And it's NOT going to make 400HP; it'd most likely be a 2.0L F4 turbo, just like Subarus, which make approximately what the 2.7L F6 base engine on Caymans and Boxsters do. But with the added torque, they'd be closer to the S models in performance IMO. It'll be interesting to watch what happens .

 

If this mythical spots car has more horsepower than a base 911, it ceases to be a Cayman and it will be named something else. :2cents:

Cheers

 

Re: Four cylinder Boxster/Cayman a reality!

That 4 banger won't sound like a sixer!

 

That 4 banger won't sound like a sixer!

Obviously. But my point is it's not bad at all. MUCH better than a turbo I4 IMO, which all other large German brands are using now (MB, Audi, BMW, VW).

If this mythical sports car has more horsepower than a base 911, it ceases to be a Cayman and it will be named something else.

That was exactly my point. It would have similar power as now, but with a smaller FI engine. Rephrasing, a turbo F4 is almost obvious, but Porsche would give it the appropriate HP depending on which model is bolted into. If it's bolted to a 911 or a Boxster/Cayman S, even if it makes 400 HP, I would never buy one . But unfortunately, it COULD happen on the lesser Boxster/Cayman models, but just don't see it happening to the 911s. We'll find out soon enough .

 

a sad day,

i guess this will be my last boxster, and frankly if i can't get a 911 GT3 at the time, it might me my last porsche as well in the foreseen future.

today was the 1st Yr anniversary of my boxster S, great car.

 

I wonder if Subaru and Toyota/Scion will beat Porsche to the punch with the Turbo Flat 4. The FRS and BRZ are in dier need for more HP. If they where to Turbo boost it before Porsche does thier F4 then it should make some waves and sales. It also could steal sales from Porsche. Those same sales that has people doing the 10% down.

Should be interesting to see how this unfolds...

One other thing, present Porsche/VW leadership are pushing thier agenda. Once they are out in a few years then the direction of this could easily change.

Don't forget the rumored 200-300K+ (ferrari, lambo challanger) Porsche Super car is still on the horizon. The 918 is miles past that and they need a car between the Turbo S and the 918.

 

Don't disagree with you at all JC, but kinda wonder.... Will our kids look at "missing the manual transmission" in the same way we look at missing a horse drawn carriage? I love a manual and that is all I have driven since I started driving, but now wonder if the PDK would really not be that bad after all..hehe!

 

The minute they drop the performance of the base 911 below the Cayman, the 911 will lose market share to the more agile sibling.

Cheers

 

This is an interesting thread. I feel differently than most of you because I come from 10 years of driving a turbo four cyl Audi. I love my Cayman's handling but quite honestly I miss the midrange torque of the Turbo four cyl. (mine is stage 2) I drove it a bit this weekend and even with the faster Cayman S now as a garage mate, the Audi is impressive when you simply wish to accelerate without all the drama of downshifting and 5000+ rpm. Mash the pedal. watch the boost gauge. woosh. Sure there is some lag. I have had to adjust to the lack of it. My right foot anticipates and in the Cayman it seems that I'm often a bit too abrupt with the throttle. I don't think there is ANYTHING to fear in a 350 or so hp turbo 4 cyl Cayman. I may want one.