[JCtx]

Re: here we go....395hp in the future........

I much rather have the current engine than even a 500 flat 4, but to each his own. With that mentality, you'd never buy anything, because things will always keep changing . And lately, not for the better IMO. Electric power steering, no manual tranny in many cars, smaller turbo/SC engines, etc. And technology will continue to detract from the driving experience, with drive-by-wire brakes, steering, etc. Yes, power seems to keep increasing (there has to be a limit, and we might be reaching it already), but I don't care when done with force induction. To each his own though.

 

[gtim]

Re: here we go....395hp in the future........

I'm not a fan of moving from 6 cylinders, down to a 4 cylinder turbo. However, if they can incorporate the hybrid technology in the 918 to add more torque where you normally get turbo lag, that could be cool. Of course, the engine probably won't sound as good, but we might get similar, smooth performance while being better for the environment.

 

[JedClampet]

Ok. I'll start it.

Next Porsche Boxster And Cayman Will Get Flat Four, Possibly 400 HP

"We had heard rumors of Porsche lopping two cylinders off the next generation Boxster and Cayman, but now Porsche head honcho Matthias Müller has confirmed the news. Oh, and he said they might have 400 horsepower. Whaaaaaaaaa?"

Let the speculation begin...

This post from 6 months ago or so may have been pretty close to what is going to happen: http://www.planet-9.com/981-chat/87.../87129-981-owners-why-you-not-more-concerned-about-4cyl-turbo-4.html#post772104

 

[Wild Weasel]

This post from 6 months ago or so may have been pretty close to what is going to happen: http://www.planet-9.com/981-chat/87.../87129-981-owners-why-you-not-more-concerned-about-4cyl-turbo-4.html#post772104

Sure, but up until recently there's been nothing official from Porsche on the subject. Now they've apparently confirmed it and it's just a matter of time, hence the new thread.

 

[chows4us]

Multiple threads merged. Please don't start another thread on the exact same subject.

 

[JedClampet]

Sure, but up until recently there's been nothing official from Porsche on the subject. Now they've apparently confirmed it and it's just a matter of time, hence the new thread.

The purpose of my post was not to suggest that this information already existed, it was to respond to many of the replies to this thread that suggested that something approaching 400hp wasn't going to happen in the BS and CS because that would step on the 911. Based on the earlier info, it looks like everything in the line would be going turbo and the 911 would see higher performance too and keep it above the BS and CS.

 

[Wild Weasel]

The purpose of my post was not to suggest that this information already existed, it was to respond to many of the replies to this thread that suggested that something approaching 400hp wasn't going to happen in the BS and CS because that would step on the 911. Based on the earlier info, it looks like everything in the line would be going turbo and the 911 would see higher performance too and keep it above the BS and CS.

Ah. I gotcha.

And I agree that this seems like the scenario that makes the most sense. Maybe it'll end up like the Macan and we'll have a 981 S and a 981 Turbo except they'll both have turbos so the names don't make any real sense.

 

[black987]

Tremendous, deep and heartfelt apologies for creating a WHOLE new thread on this topic. I'm waiting for the anti-duplicate thread police to knock down my door! Hopefully my beheading will be quick and painless. And I dearly hope my thread doesn't crash Ken's server! That extra, not to mention immense, 5K of data could start those hard drives smoking!

Ya know, I get the whole why-create-a-new-thread-on-a-topic-that-is-already-being-discussed argument... makes perfect sense. But what irks me is the attitude some people take when it happens. Really? Is it that big of a deal?

I will take a self-imposed exhile from P9 for a few days as punishment. See ya when I get out of solitary...

 

[ralarcon]

I remain skeptical.

Cheers

 

[ralarcon]

Tremendous, deep and heartfelt apologies for creating a WHOLE new thread on this topic. I'm waiting for the anti-duplicate thread police to knock down my door! Hopefully my beheading will be quick and painless. And I dearly hope my thread doesn't crash Ken's server! That extra, not to mention immense, 5K of data could start those hard drives smoking!

Ya know, I get the whole why-create-a-new-thread-on-a-topic-that-is-already-being-discussed argument... makes perfect sense. But what irks me is the attitude some people take when it happens. Really? Is it that big of a deal?

I will take a self-imposed exhile from P9 for a few days as punishment. See ya when I get out of solitary...

LOL :hilarious:

Cheers

 

[16984]

Tremendous, deep and heartfelt apologies for creating a WHOLE new thread on this topic. I'm waiting for the anti-duplicate thread police to knock down my door! Hopefully my beheading will be quick and painless. And I dearly hope my thread doesn't crash Ken's server! That extra, not to mention immense, 5K of data could start those hard drives smoking!

Ya know, I get the whole why-create-a-new-thread-on-a-topic-that-is-already-being-discussed argument... makes perfect sense. But what irks me is the attitude some people take when it happens. Really? Is it that big of a deal?

I will take a self-imposed exhile from P9 for a few days as punishment. See ya when I get out of solitary...

I believe the reasoning behind this is to improve the search function for all. What kind of sense does it make to search and come up with a multitude of threads when all info could easily be in one? It helps existing and new members.

 

[blinsc]

I believe the reasoning behind this is to improve the search function for all. What kind of sense does it make to search and come up with a multitude of threads when all info could easily be in one? It helps existing and new members.

The problem with having everything in one thread is the signal-to-noise ratio. When a thread has 85 pages and within that thread an untold number of off-topic/joking/sub-tangent posts, you can't reasonably expect someone to read through all of that. Threads get like that after countless merges. But if you use a strong hand to keep everything on topic, and delete duplicate threads, it begins to feel oppressive.

I don't know what a good solution is other than to just accept that if you post a new thread without doing an extensive once-over of the existing topics, you may have your thread merged and/or you may be gently derided or admonished for not using the search function.

 

[16984]

The problem with having everything in one thread is the signal-to-noise ratio. When a thread has 85 pages and within that thread an untold number of off-topic/joking/sub-tangent posts, you can't reasonably expect someone to read through all of that. Threads get like that after countless merges. But if you use a strong hand to keep everything on topic, and delete duplicate threads, it begins to feel oppressive.

I don't know what a good solution is other than to just accept that if you post a new thread without doing an extensive once-over of the existing topics, you may have your thread merged and/or you may be gently derided or admonished for not using the search function.

But you can search within a thread as well as search the forum.

 

[classj]

But you can search within a thread as well as search the forum.

I already have a 4 cyl Porsche. It is called a 944. :dance:

Honestly I think it is a poor decision on Porsche's part to some extent. 4Cyl Turbo is "working" for BMW and Audi since they have a very different mainstream client who care more about things like gas mileage and use the car for transportation. Much of their customer base could care less whether there was an engine or a "power cube" under the hood. Porsche buyers are a different matter.

Porsche 981's used as daily drivers are the exception. I use mine year round along with another car. If it got 5-10 mpg more I could care less.

I am sure it will be a great engine, but there will always be a place in my heart for naturally aspirated engines.

 

[JCtx]

What would make sense to me is make the base Boxster and Caymans F4-turbo, and leave the other engines as they are. Porsche should continue using NA engines and manual transmissions IMO. But we'll know soon if both are in the cards. If turbos supplant NA, then the range-topping 'turbo' would obviously disappear. If only F-4s are turbo, the 911 turbo would mean 6-cyl turbo (just like the Panamera turbo refers to the V8), but if any other 6-cyl is turbocharged, then that'd be out the window.

Finally, I have to say the Subaru turbos I've heard (with the quad pipes, and some kind of sport exhaust) sound awesome and unique IMO. The F4-turbo is coming for sure; the only question is where it'd be used. And it's NOT going to make 400HP; it'd most likely be a 2.0L F4 turbo, just like Subarus, which make approximately what the 2.7L F6 base engine on Caymans and Boxsters do. But with the added torque, they'd be closer to the S models in performance IMO. It'll be interesting to watch what happens .

 

[fast1]

PS: Following is for WW; it isn't a comment, one way or the other, about chows4us' post.

Read my lips: " P will NEVER, EVER let the 981 get close to the HP ratings of the 911." The 911 is a cash cow, to say nothing about it's status as a sacred icon. The 981 already out-handles the 911; as acknowledged by every major auto mag. Giving the 981 as much power as the 911 would cannibalize 911 sales, and P ain't gonna let that happen. Don't even bother dreaming about it. If you want more power, go aftermarket or see Ruf.

That's been the history, but a turbo engine changes the dynamic. It costs a significant amount of money to add 20 HP in the 981S, but with a turbo engine a $500 ECU change would increase the boost and you could easily add 50 HP+.

 

[Goofnik]

Honestly I think it is a poor decision on Porsche's part to some extent..

CAFE fines are $55 per vehicle, per mpg the vehicle is under CAFE standards. NHTSA currently has the authority to raise the penalty base to $100 per vehicle per mpg under the standard, but they haven't exercised that yet.

The change in power trains is a move to ensure that the cars meet the standards. Granted, many luxury manufacturers do pay fines (some have for most of the past 20 years), and VW Group has contested the 2011 standards. Regardless, it'll be done to save a few bucks per vehicle. However, most of the incentive is economic. Customers have never been directly affected by CAFE, but instead by fuel prices. And yes, if you walk into your Porsche dealer and listen to sales conversations, you'll hear people be excited about things like improved gas mileage.

Remember, your average 911 buyer is 53. Your average Boxster buyer is 47, with Cayman being 45. Judging from talking to finance about my Cayman GTS order (where I'm putting 70% down), most Porsche buyers aren't the most fiscally responsible either (10% down and 7 year loans at 5% APR? Holy crap, people fail at math!), so they actually do care about fuel prices. So increased fuel efficiency saves money, and gets more buyers into the showroom by appearing competitive in the marketplace.

Regardless, I laugh. I'll get similar fuel economy in my Cayman GTS as I do my Mazda MX-5 which has half the torque and HP.

 

[Steven M]

Re: Four cylinder Boxster/Cayman a reality!

That 4 banger won't sound like a sixer!

 

[ralarcon]

What would make sense to me is make the base Boxster and Caymans F4-turbo, and leave the other engines as they are. Porsche should continue using NA engines and manual transmissions IMO. But we'll know soon if both are in the cards. If turbos supplant NA, then the range-topping 'turbo' would obviously disappear. If only F-4s are turbo, the 911 turbo would mean 6-cyl turbo (just like the Panamera turbo refers to the V8), but if any other 6-cyl is turbocharged, then that'd be out the window.

Finally, I have to say the Subaru turbos I've heard (with the quad pipes, and some kind of sport exhaust) sound awesome and unique IMO. The F4-turbo is coming for sure; the only question is where it'd be used. And it's NOT going to make 400HP; it'd most likely be a 2.0L F4 turbo, just like Subarus, which make approximately what the 2.7L F6 base engine on Caymans and Boxsters do. But with the added torque, they'd be closer to the S models in performance IMO. It'll be interesting to watch what happens .

If this mythical spots car has more horsepower than a base 911, it ceases to be a Cayman and it will be named something else. :2cents:

Cheers

 

[JCtx]

That 4 banger won't sound like a sixer!

Obviously. But my point is it's not bad at all. MUCH better than a turbo I4 IMO, which all other large German brands are using now (MB, Audi, BMW, VW).

If this mythical sports car has more horsepower than a base 911, it ceases to be a Cayman and it will be named something else.

That was exactly my point. It would have similar power as now, but with a smaller FI engine. Rephrasing, a turbo F4 is almost obvious, but Porsche would give it the appropriate HP depending on which model is bolted into. If it's bolted to a 911 or a Boxster/Cayman S, even if it makes 400 HP, I would never buy one . But unfortunately, it COULD happen on the lesser Boxster/Cayman models, but just don't see it happening to the 911s. We'll find out soon enough .